CA WORLD SERVICE BOARD OF TRUSTEES REGULAR QUARTERLY MEETING MINUTES
March 11th – March 13th, 2011
FINAL
Since this report is a confidential CA document, for members only, it may contain members‘ full names. This usage to facilitate communication within the fellowship was approved by the 1990 WS Conference. Such confidential use does not, of course, violate in any way our Tradition on anonymity in public communications media (press, radio, TV, etc.
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Kim S.: Welcome to the WSBT quarterly meeting, March 11-13, 2011. It is now 7:11 pm pst. We have an agenda in front of us. We are going to start with personal sharing, which we will go offline for.
We are back on the record after personal sharing; it is 9:13 pst, Friday, March 11. We will start this meeting with a quiet time, followed by the Serenity Prayer. [Serenity Prayer]
Let‘s start with roll call, with Peter.
Peter DeRafaelle, World Service Trustee.
Randy Groen: Southwest Regional Trustee, WSBT Vice-Chair.
Richard Leve, World Service Office Trustee.
Robert Lyle, Atlantic North Regional Trustee.
Joy Hutcheson, Pacific South Regional Trustee.
Kenny Williams, Atlantic South Regional Trustee.
Terry Marsden, Pacific North Regional Trustee.
Russell Sedman, European Regional Trustee.
Richard Schafer, Trustee at Large, WSBT Secretary.
Kim Sherwan, Midwest Regional Trustee, WSBT Chair. Does someone have the 12 Traditions they can read for us?
Joy H.: First Tradition: Our common welfare should come first; personal recovery depends on C.A. unity.
Second Tradition: For our group purpose, there is but one ultimate authority – a loving God as He may express Himself in our group conscience. Our leaders are but trusted servants; they do not govern.
Third Tradition: The only requirement for C.A. membership is a desire to stop using cocaine and all other mind-altering substances.
Fourth Tradition: Each group should be autonomous except in matters affecting other groups or C.A. as a whole.
Fifth Tradition: Each group has but one primary purpose – to carry its message to the addict who still suffers.
Sixth Tradition: A C.A. group ought never endorse, finance or lend the C.A. name to any related facility or outside enterprise, lest problems of money, property and prestige divert us from our primary purpose.
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Seventh Tradition: Every C.A. group ought to be fully self-supporting, declining outside contributions.
Eighth Tradition: Cocaine Anonymous should remain forever nonprofessional, but our service centers may employ special workers.
Ninth Tradition: C.A., as such, ought never be organized; but we may create service boards or committees directly responsible to those they serve.
Tenth Tradition: Cocaine Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the C.A. name ought never be drawn into public controversy.
Eleventh Tradition: Our public relations policy is based on attraction rather than promotion; we need always maintain personal anonymity at the level of press, radio, and films.
Twelfth Tradition: Anonymity is the spiritual foundation of all our Traditions, ever reminding us to place principles before personalities.
Kim S.: May I have someone read the long version of Tradition Three?
Robert L.: Our membership ought to include who suffer from cocaine, hence we may refuse none who wish to recover. ______ C.A. membership ever depend upon money or conformity.
Where any two or three addicts gather together, __________ may call themselves a C.A. group, provided that as a group they have no other affiliation.
Kim S.: We will now have limited discussion regarding Tradition Three?
Randy G.: I thank God for this tradition, because it‘s the only reason I qualified to be a member of anything when I got here. I needed a place to go, and I didn‘t even know it. But any other opportunity for me to change my life seemed to carry caveats, it included behavior that had to be accepted by my parents, it included behavior or insurance that had to be accepted by a treatment center, or it had to have every opportunity for me to change my life I thought carried caveats, and these room didn‘t. I was told that the only requirement I needed to have was the desire, and I think that is a beautiful thing.
Richard S.: I have to share, it just kept going through my head. I‘m grateful that when I came to these rooms, I know this is going into the 7th, but when they pass the basket, newcomers need not feel obligated to contribute. It didn‘t make me feel like this was about the money, it made me feel like this was a room that was open and available to me with everyone‘s experience, everyone willing to share and help me, so that‘s what I did. As the financial planners, the 7th Tradition is important for us to watch, but I cannot forget that the only requirement for membership is an honest desire, and for me, that keeps my focus on the primary purpose in these rooms.
Kim S.: Anyone else? Thanks Randy and Richard. Tonight‘s topic for discussion is the respect for others and individual accountability, and Russell has agreed to kick us off on that.
Russell S.: Love and tolerance of others is our code, with respect for others. Love and tolerance wasn‘t a principle by which I lived my life to the point of coming into Cocaine Anonymous. Very intolerant of other people. I couldn‘t really identify or engage with a loving relationship
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with other human beings on that respectful level, listening and allowing others to have their own opinion and views. For me, the amends process introduced me to this new attitude of respecting my fellows. The amends process has enabled me to continue to do this to the present day to learn about that. How easy I get drawn into gossip, dismissive comments about my friends, my work colleagues, my home group, how quickly I can join. It often seems in service, when discussion or debate can be emotive, and I‘m sure we all can identify, emotionally attached to something that needed to be the right way, just dismissive and shut down to your views on that. Trying to keep a check on that, trying to invite God to continually into this work. Responses had me recently looking at spiritual harms. Allowing people to have their own views, not trying to impose mine on them, share my views by all means, but to dismiss someone else‘s is disrespectful. In these rooms, I should be trusting that we seek through prayer and meditation God‘s will for us to carry that out. Who am I to say that how you‘re being guided and driven is your conclusion of that process. To disagree is okay, it‘s what gives us a debate. I‘ve always been encouraged to debate and to disagree gives the content of the debate, it‘s how I disagree. Can I look at you while you‘re opening your mouth and make noise and actually listen, have the respect to listen to your point of view? As I would expect you, when I am speaking, I want you to hear what it is I‘m saying and pay attention. Treat others as we would like to be treated ourselves. Individual accountability. It‘s a responsibility of the individual, it‘s not just the responsibility of the individual. As a Board, I believe we have the responsibility to each other to keep other lovingly in check. For me individually, accountability comes about with the program, it was offered to me when I came here, with inventory, counsel with another human or humans, friends, fellow Board members, sponsor, amends, and of course, prayer and meditation. As a trustee, I serve the Fellowship as part of a team. I am on the Board, we are a team. At work we have regular team meetings, how are we getting on, what issues do you have going on? Checking in with each other. Again, I can only practice that with you and listen if you do likewise with myself. Do I have enough love for my friends to say you seem a bit screwy with this one mate, do you want me to Skype you, do you want to have a chat and tell me what‘s going on? I don‘t think I need to give you guy‘s permission to call me. I think if it‘s done lovingly as a member of this Board, I feel I have that, it‘s not just a right, it‘s a responsibility to say, hey, what‘s going on, do you want some help? Have I done something personally to bother you? To prepare for the Board meeting it‘s another opportunity to look at where money and spirituality mix. For my airfare and to put me up in this hotel cost a lot of money. I need to be in a fit spiritual condition to be here. I take regular inventory. I share inventory with my sponsor on a regular basis. I step it up a couple of weeks before I come here. I don‘t want to sit here chewed up about that girl, or that guy who didn‘t put sugar in my tea at the meeting last week. Cause that‘s who I can get screwed up. That‘s how I‘ve taken notes in respect to this. Allowing you to be you, and the accountability stuff, personal accountability, and enough love and respect for you to allow you to hold me to be accountable. That‘s my starting pitch.
Group: Thank you Russell.
Kim S.: I picked the topics. I thank you Russell for starting us off. When I think about respect for others, I come out of the gate and that‘s what I‘ve got. I respect each and every one of you. What I have to practice is the principle behind that. Sometimes that gets muddy, you might say, when situations arise, and I‘m not met with that equal respect. Then I have to step back. I have some
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affirmations I read every day and one of them is ―If I love myself enough, I‘m going to attract the same love in return.‖ I have to practice that. The individual accountability, what I thought to myself is kind of what I was sharing earlier, I wanted to be a trustee. I got my name on the slate. I went through the interview process, I was offered the job, I accepted, and I knew what I was getting into. It was just another extension of what I had been doing for a number of years before I was fortunate enough to sit at this table. Although in every service position I always say, if you voted somebody in, it‘s your responsibility to make him or her accountable, if they‘re not…but on the other hand, part of the job is to be accountable. My individual accountability, to know what I am supposed to be doing. I‘ve sat on a conference calls, wrapped my head around the guidelines, wrapped my head around the Conference Committee guidelines, whatever it is, to be accountable to this Fellowship, if it means getting a newcomer to a meeting or if it means traveling to an area to hammer out some issue or go to a Celebrate Around the World or a Convention, that is part of the individual accountability to this job. And like you said, Russell, to one another. If I‘m not accountable to myself, I have no expectation to be accountable to any of you.
Richard S.: I am fortunate to have the buddy I have, because I practice what I was told, informed, how to behave. I‘ve got one mouth and two ears for a reason. And I listen, sometimes I‘m bouncing stuff off him. And I listen, with my heart. I truly listen. I was sharing it outside with Terry and Randy, it‘s about accountability to one another on this Board. One of my greatest lessons thus far was an email dialogue online with Randy. He was taught that intolerance of intolerance is still intolerance. Remember when that came out Joy? That‘s what it was. That meant something. I‘ve refrained from becoming intolerant because of it. But I am accountable to each and every member of this Board. It‘s important, it means the world to me for someone to say, hey, like you were saying when you opened this up Russell, if you‘re off track or need to talk, my suggestion to a couple of guys on the Board, was if you don‘t like what I have to say you may want to speak to a former trustee, I called Richard, when we dialogued a few months back.
Richard L.: I did.
Richard S.: To be a part of, I must contribute, it‘s not just a view, you have to be able to listen and hear other people‘s views. Continue to express my own, but be able to listen, and be open. But accountability, I expect that from each of us as well. To listen. And Russell poses some very good questions to me sometimes, and makes me smile, makes me think and opens my heart, I will tell you that man speaks directly to my heart, like Randy does. We are all here for a reason, we are a part of something wonderful.
Randy G.: My sponsor used to have me try to memorize that anger prayer, because every time I get upset with somebody, you know, a sick dude like I am, God save me from being angry, God‘s will be done, blah, blah. I would always forget the how can I be helpful to them part, it‘s the easiest part of the paragraph to forget. When I think about how the topic relates to the Board of Trustees is I believe this to be the World Service Board of Trustees. This isn‘t Richard and Russell and Terry, etc., no this is the World Service Board of Trustees. Been here before we got here, will be here when we‘re gone. We‘re just some bodies that fill the slots for a while. World
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Service Board of Trustees, and with that come some expectations from the Fellowship, there are some expectations from the Office, there are some expectations that have to exist from the members, and those are high. They were high on the World Service Board of Trustees even before any of us got in any of these chairs and those expectations are going to be high for the World Service Board of Trustees even after someone is sitting here later. So when I‘m upset, how can I be helpful to them? If we‘re going to do this as a we thing, sometimes the how can I be helpful to them which I have found through working some stuff with my sponsor on some other anger issues was to be willing to have the uncomfortable conversation. If we can‘t have the uncomfortable conversation, I‘m not sure we‘re ever going to be, I would think we would find it difficult to be accountable to the expectations that these chairs have. The best I can is the best I can. But when I say yes to certain things, I don‘t consider this to be a commitment just to be at the meeting on Tuesday at 7:00. This is sitting in a position that an area, region, group of people, an office, whatever, have decided that the people in this room can represent us at what‘s considered to be a pretty important role, so that commitment has to come with the willingness to have the uncomfortable conversation, and I think we can do that with respect to each other. It has to come with a little tough skin with maybe the coffee maker that gets chewed out for not putting sugar in your tea at the meeting. We have to have a little tougher skin to be able to truly get this group and the decisions we make here to be the most accountable we can. Maybe those are the little lessons I learned as I was working my program of recovery that just gets taken in to finally sit at this table, in this chair. In prior years, I‘ve witnesses those that were sitting here with me, some uncomfortable conversations cross the line of respect, I‘ve also witnessed the Board, whether it be the chairperson or someone else at the Board that felt uncomfortable to a level that said we need to take a break, we need a time out. We need a one-on-one conversation. We can then bring it back. There is always a risk when we try so hard to do that, we might even step over the line sometimes. If it‘s consistently done with malice, that‘s another issue. I didn‘t think it was, I don‘t think it will be. I‘m willing to live with the risk of that versus trying to be afraid to go there because of the risk. I thank God for the guys in my life that are willing to have the uncomfortable conversation with me and hold me accountable. I hope this Board and future Boards feel the same.
Richard L.: Thank you Kim, very much, for this topic. Thank you Russell, for speaking out on it. I heard the word love and tolerance and I remember, and of course it comes back to the love and service part of the Fellowship that I remember. When I was new, my sponsor used to explain to me that this program was about love and service. My ego when I was new, I always wanted to be secretary of a meeting, I figured that was the biggest job you could get. He told me the most important person in the meeting was the guy who did clean up. I said I thought it was secretary, he said no, clean up was the guy who stayed after and talked to the newcomer who was afraid to go home and needed someone to talk to. The most important person makes the coffee, he makes the coffee, he gets there early and talks to the newcomer, who‘s been waiting all day to go to a meeting and needs to talk to somebody. He said the most important person in the room is person who has the literature commitment who gives the literature and the big book to the newcomer and they write their name in it and their phone number and says call me sometime if you need someone to talk to. I believe that. I got sober at Venice Beach. Some of you guys have had the honor of walking on Venice Beach, if you were there 20 some odd years ago, it was full of homeless people eating out of trash cans, I used to always talk to them, piss and moan, he used to
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take me to the people eating out of the trash can and tell me to tell them about your problems, tell them about the girl who dumped you. It would make me realize that…One of the things he taught me was the 2nd Tradition, the group conscience. When I interviewed as a Trustee about the traditions, my favorite is the 2nd Tradition, the group conscience. I believe in it. A lot of the stuff we talk and debate here are things that have been structured _________________ have come
from the World Service Conference floor. Every piece of literature has come from the Conference, approved at the World Service Conference level. That‘s what I like. We are the custodial guardians of the steps, traditions, and the concepts. Sometimes I look at us like the Supreme Court. We are not making the laws, we are just trying to make sure the laws, traditions are not being broken, or overstepped the bounds. When you say individual accountability and the respect of others, we have to respect opinions. Richard S. and I have always had an agreement. We agree to disagree. That is a respect of each other‘s opinions. We‘ve sat on boards across from each other and totally disagreed and never lashed out, and loved each other. We stepped outside, smoked cigars, discuss it. I ask, explain why you voted that way. I heard him, sometimes I sat on the fence and went on the other side. Sometimes he wasn‘t there and I said I voted on something he said if I was there I would have voted the same way you did. The deal is, that‘s what‘s kind of great about it. Unfortunately, I have, and some of us, do get very heated. There‘s many times I‘ve left the World Service Office Board at midnight and have not been able to go to sleep until 4:00 in the morning because I‘ve been so wound up from the Board meeting. It‘s gotten me going. I try to tell myself I‘m a volunteer, it‘s just a meeting. I have to let it go through, because this is a Fellowship of a program that saved my life, I understand that, but the deal is, if a group conscience is taken, I think I‘m more upset when a group conscience hasn‘t been taken, and it gets tabled. That‘s probably what keeps me up. If there‘s a vote, I can go to sleep.
Kim S.: Thank you everybody, and thank you again Russell. Next item on the agenda is the Chair‘s opening remarks. I want to remind everyone to speak up for the microphones and keep the eating and drinking to a minimum, please. Try to eliminate your use of text messaging during this Board meeting. Review of the WSBT agenda. Does anybody have anything else they would like to add to the agenda at this time?
Richard L.: If time allows, discussion of per diems.
Kim S.: Expense reimbursement concerns, I will add it.
Richard L.: Thank you.
Kim S.: Review of Board-to-Board agenda, anything additional for that? Tomorrow‘s tentative schedule, and I say tentative because right now we are due to come back tomorrow morning at 8:00 am, we will do a limited Board to Board at 10:00 am, anticipating that going longer than an hour and a half, our lunch will go 11:30-1:00 pm. Originally the interviews were to begin at 1:15, but they will begin at 1:30. So hopefully we can all be back here by 1:00 pm, get situated, we will need a few extra chair. Peter, if you can make sure those chair are here tomorrow. We have four interviews for tomorrow. I have forwarded you electronic resumes as well as an electronic copy of the questions that the WSOB posed to the candidates. Tomorrow I will have hard copies of the resumes, as well as the questions. The interviews will be at 1:30, 2:30, 3:30, and 4:30.
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Then we can make a decision on how to proceed, if we want to go to dinner at that point, or go ahead and ratify the new DOO. Does anybody have any questions about tomorrow? Okay, date and time for the April conference call.
Richard S.: Do we have our own questions that we‘re asking for the interviews?
Richard L.: Yes, we do.
Kim S.: The questions I forwarded are the same as the questions the WSOB asked.
Peter D.: 16 of the 20 we asked.
Kim S.: Which are similar to the questions we will be asking, only we have 16 that are the same, four different. For anyone who hasn‘t sat in on TEC, other than being a candidate, it will be done the same way, we will go around the room, we will introduce ourselves, we will go around the room with questions, and you can make notes.
Joy H.: Are we going to be able to add other questions? These are the basic questions we always ask, but if we see something in their resume that we want to expand on, because we did it the last time, I believe.
Kim S.: I don‘t recall, and I don‘t know that it would be fair to each candidate to.
Joy H.: How about if we ask each one the same questions?
Richard L.: Can I share something with this Board?
Kim S.: Sure.
Richard L.: After we asked the questions, because we explained to the candidates that these are just questions, we actually put the question in front of the candidate when we did it so they could read along with it. We asked them if they had any questions for us. Then we asked them additional questions like are you experienced with QuickBooks, we wanted to get a little extra knowledge of things, hypothetical questions that we thought might be necessary for this position. It was a little bit loose in the interview afterward. We had a 10-minute conversation back and forth. How this Board wants to do it, is totally up to you.
Richard S.: About how long did each interview take based on the questions you had?
Richard L.: An hour, hour and a half.
Peter D.: 45 minutes to an hour, with 20 questions.
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Richard S.: That‘s about what we have, so I think we could discuss whether we would have time to ask any other questions with the allotted time. That‘s why I asked, I wanted to know if we could squeeze it in.
Richard L.: You might want to ask them how savvy they are with a computer, or strong they are in finances, QuickBooks.
Peter D.: Those questions are in there.
Kim S.: If we decide to allow for there to be free forum in questions, the problem is that it needs to be consistent, in my opinion. That means if you don‘t think of it with the first candidate…
Russell S.: Is there going to be any opportunity to speak with the Chair of the WSOB from their review of these resumes, if there is anyone in particular after we‘ve met them, or we‘ve been given four resumes and it really is the decision of this Board to select? Is there any input by the WSOB?
Randy G.: I would suggest that we stay to the questions that we have. I say that because I‘m not a qualified HR person. We would potentially run the risk of asking an improper question and that‘s a big deal. My feeling is that in the timeframe we have, we ask the questions, we gather the information from the four candidates, it never, I don‘t believe it precludes us in our discussions if we feel we need more information, that we need additional questions answered, I don‘t believe that there‘s been anything written in stone that wouldn‘t allow us to have that individual answer those questions for us in the future, we can make a lot of decisions with the information we have, potentially asking the WSOB chair‘s opinion or the acting managing consultant. If we‘re down, for example, potentially two candidates, and we believe that five or six additional questions asked to both candidates would help us in our decision process, I think we have all the right in the world to take that next step and create that opportunity. For the interview schedule set up for tomorrow, I‘m more comfortable with the questions just on the sheet.
Peter D.: I think we should ask the 16 questions on the sheet, at the end ask if they have any questions for us, thank them and bid them farewell. Then sit around and talk about it. If we need some input. These four were put together in a ranking, what the office board, what we all thought how they ranked. I know what that ranking is, I‘ll save that for after the interview so nobody gets biased and makes their own decision, The World Service Office Board had an opinion of what they thought first, second, third and fourth. They submitted them. I think 16 questions. Do you have any questions for us. Thank you very much, we‘ll be in touch with you. That way everything is even. If you ask a question and it‘s not the right one, like Randy said or you say something that might not be, just make it simple, I think.
Kim S.: The WSOB has put forward four, and from what I understand, what I keep being told, excellent candidates. I think we need to look at them individually, not look at them how they were rated or ranked by the previous board interview. I will continue if there are no objections to my thinking, is we have the task of interviewing and hiring a DOO based on the four candidates they put forward. We have two trustees that sit on that Board, I would imagine some of that
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discussion is going to come to this table. I agree with the sticking to the questions similar to the TEC, followed by ―do you have any questions for us?‖ Thank you very much, and then move on. Should we entertain a motion, or is everybody good by unanimous consent. Any other questions about the interview schedule for tomorrow? Time and date for the April conference call? April 17 at 11:00 am pst. Richard S. will post this on the calendar. Dates for the May quarter and CAWS 2011, we will start on Monday, May 23. Dinner at 5:00 pm, meeting at 7:00 pm. Joy is waiting to schedule the TEC interviews, we will go Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday. At some point, hopefully Wednesday or Thursday we will have at least two interviews at the convention, depending on their arrival, potentially three interviews.
Randy G.: Who arrives when?
Richard S.: I will be there Saturday.
Joy H.: I will be there Monday morning. I have a very early flight.
Randy G.: I am asking, because if all of the trustees are going to be there Monday morning or by
1:00, we could start earlier.
Kim S.: As of right now…Monday, May 23, dinner at 5:00, Randy, could you assist us with a place to eat, 7:00pm our meeting starts. The convention starts on Thursday, please keep in mind, we will be of service to our maximum at the convention, please touch base with Randy and Evan to see what we can do to help, whether it means working at memorabilia, registration, being a greeter in hospitality, whatever it is? Terry, is Unity doing something at the convention?
Terry M.: Yes, they are planning on it.
Kim S.: We will keep ourselves informed as to something we need to be at. Friday night is the Trustee dinner, the 27th. Our meetings that we need to attend are all on Sunday.
Randy G.: I will verify that, but I think Sunday is the day. I think we have enough meeting space that we don‘t have to break Saturday and Sunday mornings separate, I believe all of the conference committee meetings will be at 8:00 on Sunday morning, all of the regional meetings will be, I think at 10:00 on Sunday morning versus spreading them over two days. I don‘t have the exact times yet.
Kim S.: What Randy is saying is that at the convention, all of the conference committees meet, they are tentatively scheduled for Sunday morning at 8:00 am. If you serve to a conference committee, which we all do, we want to make sure you check the schedule. You need to go to that. Your regional caucuses are also going to be there, tentatively at 10:00 am on Sunday. We have Meet the Trustees and the Conference Forum Sunday as well?
Randy G.: Meet the Trustees, long-term planning will be after lunch, the times are 1:30, 2:30, respectively, and tentative.
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Kim S.: The Conference Forum is going to be combined with Meet the Trustees. That‘s where the three branches of the conference…Saturday is a free day.
Randy G.: We are booked Sunday from early until after banquet.
Kim S.: Typically, for the dinner, we try to get there early to be greeters as people come in for the dinner, if you have significant other, let them know they will be at the table without you, because you‘re going to be greeting at the doors as people come in.
Randy G.: The final decision on saving seats has not been made, I can tell you that it looks like the committee is not going to save any seats except the front table for the speakers.
Peter D.: So we sit at different tables then?
Randy G.: We can make that decision later.
Kim S.: That‘s actually an important question, because it‘s been different over the years, do we present ourselves as a body at one or two tables, some people have significant others there. My first year, I didn‘t sit with any of the trustees. Second year, we sat together. My third year, we had several tables in the back of the room.
Randy G.: Remember, as the greeters, we‘re in the building first. Even without saved tables, we have…
Kim S.: I‘m not worried about saving tables, what we did in Milwaukee is we had them reserve several tables in the back for us to accommodate all of us, as well as some of the other members of the WSOB that sat with us as well.
Peter D.: I was at a convention in Palm Springs, all the committees sat at a table together, I heard some remarks, like do they think they‘re better than us. They can‘t mingle, they all sit together. I think it would be better if we mingled and sat around with the other people as opposed to being the trustees, we dine together. Do we wear anything that says trustee?
Group: Yes.
Peter D.: I think we should spread ourselves around; they‘re the ones we work for.
[much mingled discussion]
Kim S.: In Milwaukee we sat in the back, in Denver, we sat in the middle of the room. We weren‘t in the front at all.
Randy G.: We should be grateful to have a seat at the convention, the ancillary stuff can be worked out.
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Kenny W.: I don‘t care where I sit, I‘m just happy to be there.
Kim S.: It‘s not a matter of being happy or not, it‘s how it‘s perceived by our Fellowship. Some of the Fellowship perceives that we should be acknowledged as a group, sitting together. Another part thinks like Russell and Peter that we should be scattered amongst. There is another part of the Fellowship that thinks, we are the Fellowship too, shouldn‘t we sit with whomever we choose? My first year, I sat with people from my area. Although we think it‘s not a big deal, it‘s obviously something we have several different opinions about. We probably need to make a decision. We can decide this as we get closer, we can decide this in May. That‘s when we made our decision, in Milwaukee, the week of the convention. Anything else about the schedule, Randy, Joy?
Joy H.: Between you, Robert and I, we will hopefully be able to actually nail down the date and how many.
Randy G.: Do you have a feeling yet as to the TEC delegates, as to how many are going to make it?
Kim S.: You might want to get an email off to the TEC and see how many will be there.
Potentially, we may be doing all of the interviews in Phoenix.
Joy H.: We could do all three interviews there. I will send an email out.
Randy G.: Is that because none of the people we‘re interviewing will be attending the conference?
Kim S.: Yes, two will be at the convention and not the conference. The third is not giving a solid answer as to what they‘re doing, where they‘re going to be.
Joy H.: I emailed the other two requesting their date of arrival at the convention. I emailed the other two requesting their actual date of arrival at the convention and received no response.
Kim S.: At this point, we will work on the third one, maybe a phone call to the other two candidates on the slate.
Joy H.: If you send me your TEC delegate information, I don‘t have it all, I can actually send out the email and get that all taken care of.
Kim S.: Everybody has supplied you with his or her arrival dates, room reservations…
Peter D.: All turned in to, what‘s his name?
Richard S.: The hotel liaison?
Peter D.: Everything has been turned in to him.
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Kim S.: Everybody has coordinated his or her roommate situations?
Peter D.: Can I ask you a question about that, or is that not the time?
Kim S.: I believe it is in new business. We are at the approval of minutes. First item for approval is 10.12 WSBT Quarterly Minutes of 2010.
Joy H.: Motion to table 10.12 Quarterly Minutes and 10.12 WSOB Board-to-Board Minutes.
Richard L.: Second.
Kim S. There is a motion to table the 10.12 Quarterly Minutes and 10.12 WSOB Board to Board Minutes. Any discussion?
Richard S.: Do we have an estimated timeframe on estimated delivery on those minutes?
Kim S.: My last communication with the transcriber is we should have them any day. There was an issue with the pedal, and the computer as well, from one laptop to another. Hopefully soon. We can table it and approve them online. All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion approved to table, please move this item online.
Next item is the January of 2011 WSBT conference call minutes. We do not have the minutes from the January or February conference calls.
Joy H.: I would like to make a motion to table the 11.01 WSBT and 11.02 WSBT conference call minutes.
Robert L.: Second.
Kim S.: Motion by Joy to table the January and February conference call minutes, second by Robert. Any discussion?
Joy H.: We will have those when?
Richard S.: Before the next online call.
Joy H.: Thank you.
Kim S.: Any other discussion? All those in favor? All opposed. Motion carries. Next item is the approval for the December 2010 through March 2011 WSBT online minutes?
Joy H.: Motion to approve the December 2010-March 2011 WSBT online minutes.
Richard S.: Second.
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Kim S.: Motion by Joy to approve the December 2010-March 2011 WSBT online minutes, seconded by Richard S. Did everyone read them? Thank you. All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion carries.
Joy H.: Motion to approve the WSBT Officer, Chair, Vice-Chair, and Secretary reports.
Robert L.: Second.
Kim S. Motion by Joy to approve the WSBT Officer, Chair, Vice-Chair, and Secretary reports, seconded by Robert. Any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion carries.
Joy H.: Motion to approve all trustee reports, including Atlantic North, Atlantic South, Midwest, Pacific North, Pacific South, Southwest, European, Trustee at Large, World Service Office Trustee, and World Service Trustee.
Peter D.: Second.
Kim S.: Motion by Joy to approve all trustee reports, including Atlantic North, Atlantic South, Midwest, Pacific North, Pacific South, Southwest, European, Trustee at Large, World Service Office Trustee, and World Service Trustee, seconded by Peter. Any discussion?
Randy G.: There were a couple of regional reports that did not have the 7th Tradition or even a summary of a 7th Tradition report. Because we don‘t do a separate cumulative report, I would like to make note that in the future it would be good to make sure that gets in our regional reports.
Kim S.: Can you clarify who did not include that, so they may be made aware?
Randy G.: I believe two, if not three, I would rather not guess.
Kim S.: For informational purposes, any regional trustee, we receive the 7th Tradition report that Richard Leve sends to us, you should copy your regional 7th Tradition report and paste it at the end of your regional report.
Richard L.: If you need help, call the office. John or myself will be more than glad to give you those numbers, or Joy.
Kim S.: Any other discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion carries.
Joy H.: Motion to approve the WSBT subcommittee reports, including Finance, International Structure and Development, Legal, Long-Term Planning, NewsGram, Orientation, Trustee Election, Trustee Negotiation, Trustee Outreach, and the World Service Conference.
Peter D.: Second.
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Kim S.: Motion by Joy Motion to approve the WSBT subcommittee reports, including Finance, International Structure and Development, Legal, Long-Term Planning, NewsGram, Orientation, Trustee Election, Trustee Negotiation, Trustee Outreach, and the World Service Conference, seconded by Peter. Is there any discussion?
Richard S.: Robert, is your report there?
Robert L.: Yes.
Richard S.: Thank you.
Terry M.: I did submit an amended report.
Joy H.: It is in the next motion.
Terry M.: Sorry.
Kim S.: Any other discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion carries.
Joy H.: Motion to approve the Trustee Conference Committee reports, with the exception of Convention Committee Reports. Motion to include Archives, Finance, H&I, IT, Literature, Chips and Format, Public Information, Structure and Bylaws, Amended Unity Report.
Robert L.: Second.
Kim S.: A motion by Joy to approve the Trustee Conference Committee reports, with the exception of Convention Committee Reports. Motion to include Archives, Finance, H&I, IT, Literature, Chips and Format, Public Information, Structure and Bylaws, Amended Unity Report, seconded by Robert. Any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed. Motion carries, thank you.
Randy G.: Motion to approve the CAWS 2011 Convention report.
Kim S.: I‘m sorry, that would be out of order. We would like to approve the convention report submitted by Peter.
Peter D.: I did not submit a report, I forgot that one.
Kim S.: For the record, we do not have a Conference Committee Report for Convention, we will look for that online to approve so it can be included in the minutes.
Peter D.: I will do that. My apologies.
Randy G.: Motion to approve the CAWS 2011 report.
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Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: Motion to approve the CAWS 2011 report, seconded by Joy. Any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes with minor opposition.
Russell S.: Motion to approve the CAWS 2012 report.
Richard S.: Second.
Kim S. There has been a motion to approve the CAWS 2012 report, seconded by Richard S., any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes.
Kenny W.: Motion to approve the CAWS 2013 report.
Richard L.: Second.
Kim S.: Motion by Kenny to approve the CAWS 2013 report. Any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion carries.
Joy H.: Motion to approve CAWS 2014 report.
Peter D.: Second.
Kim S.: Motion to approve the CAWS 2014 report by Joy, seconded by Peter. Any discussion? All those in favor, anyone opposed. Motion passes. For the records, all reports with the exception of the Conference Committee Convention report have been approved and we will look for that report from Peter online before we submit these quarterly minutes to the Fellowship.
We are at place marker business items. The first item is 2006.02.20 Copyright and Trademark Protection. Peter?
Peter D.: I sent out, there was a request for certain people who wanted a written statement from the attorneys saying where the ® goes on our logo, I posted that on the Yahoo group. just to refresh everybody‘s memory, if you go anywhere outside the circle or inside the first two lines. He said if it goes in with the CA, just the CA is, the whole thing, you could put it between Faith and Courage, or Hope and Courage, inside the circle or anywhere outside that circle.
Randy G.: It cannot go next to the A?
Peter D.: It can‘t go inside the circle, it has to be inside the circle where it says Hope, Faith & Courage, or it could go outside the circle.
Randy G.: So we have to re-do our chips?
Peter D.: Why is it inside the circle?
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Unknown: Yes.
Peter D.: He said if you put it next to the CA and exclude Hope, Faith & Courage, it will look like just the CA is registered. He said all that ® is for is to show other people that that whole thing is registered.
Richard L.: Let me just piggyback on what Peter is saying. The ® is so that people know, it‘s acknowledging the trademark, that we own that logo. This is a registered trademark logo.
Randy G.: I need some direction, I had seen the communication from Peter that said this, given that information to the Convention Committee, the ® could be inside, I used the chip as an example of that, I know our memorabilia for the 2011 convention, it‘s a big deal because of how we can do all of our memorabilia now without having to have the ® on the outside, and I know they placed it next to the A, like we do our chips. I would like approval to allow that memorabilia to go forward with that. Or is that an issue that we need to stop and have them re-do that?
Peter D.: He said that the main reason to have it is so people know that‘s trademarked. If you have it inside the C, right next to the CA, some people might, he said it‘s nothing to really worry about, if somebody does say something, we have all of the paperwork that shows what is, what isn‘t, and where it is. If you do put it right next to the CA, some people might think just the CA is registered, and it is on another sheet. It should be put on the outside so they know that whole thing is registered. I don‘t think it will make a difference at this convention for the memorabilia, I really don‘t. Will somebody see it and say they did it, let me do it the same way? You might have that problem.
Joy H.: With all of our chips, with the registered trademark symbol next to the CA, should we consider changing the dye for our chips to place the registered trademark inside the double circle for the placement, for future chips. If we believe we should, I believe this needs to be added to our Board-to-Board. I have one more question. Did we get any answer, CAWS convention logos, did we get confirmation on having to, and do they fall under the copyright or not?
Randy G.: The artwork?
Joy H.: The CAWS convention artwork, does that fall under the copyright. I know we do have the artist sign a release, we still have a response we need to answer.
Kim S.: Are we looking for, if the artwork includes the logo, is it then covered by our trademark and copyright?
Joy H.: Correct.
Randy G.: If the artwork were to be used at a later date without our logo, do they have permission to do that?
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Peter D.: Good question, I never asked that one.
Kim S.: That is an outstanding issue for us, we need resolution.
Peter D.: It was never put to me that way, I‘m going to have say, I don‘t know, I will find out.
Richard L.: If they sign a release form giving us ownership, that‘s the question.
Randy G.: Has anyone seen this release form, is it ownership? Permission to use and they can use that artwork at a later date without the logo.
Joy H.: There seem to be issues in my region of using flyer convention artwork, selling it without, it‘s old logos.
Randy G.: Selling it as CA? If CA is making the money, what‘s the big deal?
Richard L.: It could be an old design.
Randy G.: It‘s not CA selling it, rather members selling for personal gain?
Richard L.: Like CA from 1986 now they want to do 2012, they want the artwork from then and bring it back, can they?
Joy H.: With the old logo, in the beginning all we had was the CA…
Richard L.: It is different from today.
Peter D.: If it doesn‘t look like that, it doesn‘t matter.
Richard L.: The font is different. It‘s an old CA font.
Richard S.: But they‘re attempting to use it.
Randy G.: I know there is a t-shirt design that has been put forward, I know in 2000 we did the 1990 for the World Convention with the 2000 logo and said Keep Coming Back as a secondary shirt. I know there is discussion now to do the 1990 logo, the 2000 logo and the 2011 logo in a shirt with some recognition of the three events in Phoenix as part of the memorabilia. If we own that logo and Cocaine Anonymous wants to continue to use that logo, that artwork in the future, it‘s Cocaine Anonymous‘, we are the ones who own it.
Joy H.: Do we?
Kim S.: I feel we need to look at the release form and verbiage on that with respect to what exactly it says, does it say ―release all rights to‖?
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Randy G.: We are not changing it, the release form is in place if we continue to use it ten years later, five years later…
Kim S.: We need to know exactly what the release form says.
Richard L.: I would be more than happy to go to the office and do the research on it.
Joy H.: That is the main question. If CAWS, the Board of Trustees, actually, if the release form doesn‘t give us the full rights to that artwork, legally…
Randy G.: An area can use it, sell it?
Joy H.: No, the person that created the artwork still maintains ownership.
Peter D.: If he signs it over to CA…
Randy G.: I want to be clear about my earlier question. The person that does this is doing it to sell CA memorabilia. Cocaine Anonymous is receiving the money for the future sale of this item.
Joy H.: Correct, but if the person did not literally sign off ownership of that artwork, do we legally have the right to use it over and over again without…
Randy G.: Whether it is ownership or permission, we do.
Kenny W.: You‘re talking logic, we are talking legally.
Kim S.: We need to see it in writing and have this confirmed.
Randy G.: A release form doesn‘t have an expiration date.
Joy H.: It could be argued in court.
Kenny W.: They can say, I didn‘t mean it. I did the artwork, but I didn‘t say that if you say I did.
It‘s mine.
Richard S.: We have discussion on the table regarding Randy‘s question, regarding the current convention memorabilia with the ® next to the A of the CA. Has that memorabilia been produced already?
Randy G.: I believe the orders have been placed.
Richard S.: I would like to see if the best effort can be made to see if the artwork can be changed, if it can‘t, it can‘t. That‘s my opinion, you asked. Please research, best effort would be change to correct it, that would be appropriate and great, if it can‘t, it can‘t.
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Kim S.: With the knowledge we have now, it is something we need to strongly ask S&B to get into the manual and clarify where the ® is supposed to be. Joy, if that needs to be a referral, you‘ll take lead on that?
Joy H.: Absolutely.
Kim S.: Thank you. The verbiage needs to be, the ® can be outside the circle, or inside the double circle.
Joy H.: Correct, got it.
Kim S.: Randy you will follow-up regarding your memorabilia?
Randy G.: Yes, I will.
Peter D.: So the block letters CA may only be used alone when they bear no resemblance to the inner circle type style of the logo. We have the mark CA, it is registered in Canada and the United States only. Our counselor suggested strongly so nobody in Europe uses CA, that we register that. It‘s $2,500 to file, $1,000 for the prosecutor‘s foreign whatever that is, and $1,500 to issue, which takes about a year and a half. So $5,000 off the bat, it‘s going to be good for ten years and 27 countries, you start out with a down payment, and pay as you go. He strongly suggested it. Another thing he mentioned. That‘s without the periods. If you want to spend another $5,000, you can register it with the periods. Since he is the attorney, I kind of go along with him. We‘re Here and We‘re Free is registered in Canada and the United States only. If we want to register that in Europe, that‘s another $5,000. He didn‘t think it was necessary to register those five words, it‘s up to us. He does not recommend it. We‘re Here and We‘re Free, if you want to spend the money, we can.
Joy H.: On our agenda it shows in red We‘re Here and We‘re Free are protected in Canada, U.S. and EU that is incorrect?
Peter D.: What he sent me says Canada started in 1997, certified in the USA registered, nothing about Europe. Cocaine Anonymous is registered all over the world.
Kim S.: The words ―We‘re Here and We‘re Free‖ is in the agenda is in red means it‘s something we‘re pursuing.
Joy H.: I would like to make a motion that we register the block letters CA in Europe.
Robert L.: Second.
Kim S.: Motion to register the block letters CA in Europe by Joy, second by Robert. Discussion?
Kenny W.: If I heard Peter correctly, he said this would cost $5,000?
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Peter D.: Over a period of 1-1/2 to two years.
Kenny W.: And how long does that last?
Peter D.: Ten years, after that, there is a fee to maintain. Renewal fees are $500 every ten years.
Kenny W.: Initially it is $5,000, then every ten years it‘s $500.
Peter D.: Billed out in increments. For example, when they did Cocaine Anonymous, it was $427, then $500, then $506, etc. The billing is spread out, it‘s not just a single bill, it‘s spread out over the time it takes to register. Starting with application fee, legal fees.
Russell S.: I speak for the motion. Can you please clarify where in Europe? What countries?
Peter D.: European communities, Austria, Benelux, European Communities, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Sweden, United Kingdom. Richard S.: Can I get that electronically?
Peter D.: I don‘t know.
Richard S.: Can I get a hard copy?
Richard L.: I can scan it for you.
Richard S.: Thank you.
Peter D.: He will do it everywhere we need it.
Joy H.: For $5,000
Peter D.: Ballpark. The way it‘s written, its $2,500 to file, $1,000 for the prosecution. $1,000 the second year to the prosecutors, and $1,500 to issue, 27 countries, ten years.
Kim S.: It is important for the record we have all of those listed.
Richard S.: For our transcriber, if you could please read them in?
Peter D.: European Community. Countries: Austria, Benelux, Canada, Denmark, France, Germany, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Portugal, Spain, Sweden, United Kingdom. He also said that European Community, whatever countries we miss are covered there. He will spell it all out.
Richard S.: This is the registration for the item the attorney suggested we register?
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Peter D.: Yes. When I asked him all the questions, that‘s what he suggested we do, he said everything else is just fine.
Richard S.: Thank you for your work.
Kim S.: Are there any other questions? Does everyone understand the extreme importance of spending the money to do this?
There is a motion to register the block letters CA in Europe at the cost of $5,000 over two years, good for ten years, per the attorneys, made by Joy, seconded by Robert. All those in favor, anyone opposed. Motion passes. Peter, you will please follow through with this.
Peter D.: Could you put approximately $5,000, he did say ballpark.
Kim S.: You can make a motion to amend, it‘s already approved.
Peter D.: Motion to amend previous motion to say approximately $5,000 and approximately 1-1/2 to two years.
Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to amend previous motion to say approximately $5,000 and approximately 1-1/2 to two years, made by Peter, seconded by Joy. Any additional discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes.
Randy G.: With this new knowledge, similar to the ® thing in our chips, do we need to ask Structure and Bylaws to go through our entire World Service Manual and remove the periods?
Joy H.: That‘s housekeeping.
Randy G.: For as many years as I‘ve been attending the Conference, we have individuals who will absolutely take the microphone and say ―this reads our logo is C.A., not CA,‖ every year. If our registered block letters CA don‘t include periods, do we need to ask this to be changed?
Richard S.: As far as the English language is concerned, if you‘re abbreviating C.A., it is still appropriate, so it depends on how the words are being used.
Joy H.: Absolutely.
Kim S.: The service mark C.A. is registered?
Joy H.: No.
Kim S.: That has been a place marker for four years, so now would it be logical to say that it can be either or C.A./CA, or is it strictly CA?
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Peter D.: Here‘s the deal. When I asked him about that he said somebody from CA, not him, put the period after CA to distinguish it between California and Cocaine Anonymous. He said if somebody was to come in, another company, and use C.A., they can‘t do it, because even though C.A. is not registered, because it‘s way to close to CA. He said just because you don‘t have the period it could go into a legal battle, but as long as it‘s, they can‘t use CA with a period because you‘ve trademarked CA. You can put a period next to the CA., but you‘ll have to do the whole thing over again, starting from scratch. You just can‘t refile it with the period, it must go through initial registration again. If somebody came up and put it, like Charlie‘s Angels came up and put CA, other than our logo looks like here, there‘s an argument there. If it resembles our logo, it cannot be used. I am going to talk to him again, I will ask him about the next issue, never mind, that‘s the only place you have it.
Kim S.: I have a picture that hangs on the wall at the office, there are no periods. It is from the United States Patent and Trademark Office.
Randy G.: It has been argued at the Conference for years, everything we do comes out with periods on it.
Kenny W.: They were wrong.
Richard L.: I am going to use the word font. The CA font, is the design. That part is our work. Richard is kind of correct, using the abbreviation C for Cocaine, A for Anonymous, you‘re abbreviating. We are CA, That is our registered trade name. People use the period only because here in California you got an envelope, you write CA then a ZIP code. Then they said if we put CpointApoint it won‘t be confused, it‘s just an abbreviation of that. We are going to be right, there will be debate.
Joy H.: Technically, the C.A. in reference in our manual should not be there.
Richard S.: Depends on the context.
Joy H.: Let‘s go to page 13 of the manual. In the box on page 13 of the 2010 manual, it says the Cocaine Anonymous logo must be used in it‘s entirety as shown below, which we can now have two logos there, one with the little ® on the outside, one with the ® on the inside. The official logo includes the inner circle, the logo that includes the artistic text ―CA‖, the outer circle that contains the text Hope, Faith & Courage and the registered trademark symbol. No other text or design element may touch, overlap or show through behind the logo beside a solid color. The block letters ―C.A.‖ may only be used…So that actually just ―CA.‖
Kim S.: I would suggest anyone that questions that visit the office, it‘s up on the wall.
Randy G.: We need to make that change.
Joy H.: Yes.
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Randy G.: We have to make the C.A., remove the periods.
Joy H.: I will write an email to Structure and Bylaws, tell them for housekeeping purposes, the period between the C and the A on this particular page need to be removed, that we need, if someone has the logo with the little circle with the ® inside the two inner circles between Courage and Faith, I can have S&B include that as a housekeeping item. When they fix the regions, that can be included, and it can be uploaded?
Kim S.: If the question comes, we can respond we have clarified this with our attorney. We also have to move forward with the correction on our key tags. Now it is next to the A.
Russell S.: It is around the copyright. On one of the calls, you clarified that the logo is copyrighted regardless of what language it is in, is that correct or did I misunderstand?
Peter D.: That, I have no idea. I just asked for CA. If it‘s Farsi, is it still CA or is it Farsi?
Russell S.: No, the actual logo.
Peter D.: Yes. I don‘t know about other languages, I guess like in Spanish, Hope, Faith and Courage is written differently. I don‘t know that. I could ask.
Kim S.: We do know that.
Peter D.: My understanding, for example, the shirt with the nine logos, and English on the back, I believe there are three that have the ® and the remainder do not. I do not know who made the determination as to which would or would not. That led me to believe we have individual registrations for those languages, however, not for all nine.
Kim S.: When that was researched, we had clarification of what was and was not registered. Correct?
Randy G.: I have to talk to Terry and find out exactly how that occurred. I believe three of those have the ®, some did not, we did not believe they were registered.
Peter D.: Would it make sense, if it‘s registered in Germany, that it would be registered in the German language? Or is that a question I should ask?
Russell S.: I am asking is some branding, for example, Coca Cola® in Germany doesn‘t need to be trademark, because the brand is Coca Cola…
Randy G.: I found it at the last quarterly. When we were actually at the office, I went online and Googled copyright laws, we were talking about translations. The copyright actually goes with the translations and where it came from is that a book, you write a book, it is translated into another language. That copyright goes with that translation.
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Richard S.: Peter, I know you were going to try and be frugal with communication with the attorney and getting this information. I would like to know if we‘ve had any expenses thus far.
Peter D.: $125.
Richard S.: Thank you so much, money well spent.
Peter D.: I asked him when we talked, do you punch that clock as soon as we start talking? When he types, he charges.
Richard S.: That is a fantastic price for information received.
Peter D.: I was collecting checks in San Diego, people were making checks out to CA. I took them to the bank, they would not take the checks for deposit cause it‘s made out to CA, to the bank that meant California. I had to go out and come back in with them changed to CA of San Diego.
Robert L.: I am glad we took the time to do this, because we have been ________ false
information. We‘ve been playing lawyer at times, I‘m grateful that, glad we made the effort to clean up our side of the street.
Kim S.: I will meet with Peter and make sure everything is in order as a place marker. Thank you Peter. Next item is marker 2006.08.13, signature of annual corporate documents. That was completed and will be completed next fall as well. Marker 2009.05.09, financial status, CAWS, Inc. Joy, Richard Leve?
Joy H.: If you all remember from our workshop that we did, as of December 31, 2010, CAWSO is carrying a -$32,467.86, which is actually, approximately $6,000 more than last year. We are right on track, due to the fact that all of our income shows up at the end of our fiscal year, all of our expenses show up at the beginning of the fiscal year. We are right on track. A little higher than last year, about $6,000.
Kim S.: Is there anything else we want on the record to be addressed at the Board-to-Board? Marker for the Drug Court/NADCP, to be held in Maryland.
Richard S.: I have received a preliminary budget from the office, included on the email were the chair, Tom P., and treasurer, Barry J. I received that from John. We are on track, he is communicating regarding scheduling and registering. We are attending.
Richard L.: Who will be attending?
Richard S.: Myself, Robert, and usually the DOO. It‘s my experience that whoever is at Drug Court and communicates with us, will not communicate with Robert or I, they will communicate with the Office, that is the key person to be there. It‘s still planned that the third person, hopefully will be available to go, I would suggest that if not, the Chair goes. Someone who has
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longevity at the office. We have a booth, I have a picture if you‘d like to see it. CA has a vendor space, we own a booth, and it‘s at the office. We hand out literature, we have handed out books the last two years, and we‘ll probably do that again this year. We gather information from the professionals that attend in hope they will utilize CA as one of their avenues for their Drug Court patients.
Kim S.: Is there any follow-up to the correspondence of last year? I know Jay Finesilver was working on that with the Office.
Richard S.: Jay, John and myself have been. There has thus far been nothing produced. There was going to be a letter assembled by Jay. To date, that has not been delivered.
Kim S.: We are going back to the trademark and copyright, Randy?
Randy G.: Regarding the Copyright Act of 2004, translations are a derivative work and only the copyright owner can authorize a translation that will be distributed. This envisions a work that is translated into another language and distributed in parts of the world where that language is spoken. Derivative works are infringing if they are not created with the permission of the copyright holder. That essentially allows us to put an ® on every single translation of our logo we want.
Russell S.: If it somehow could be recorded, that would be helpful.
Kim S.: As it has just been read into the record, I believe we are done. Thank you Randy. If our work is translated, we own it.
Kenny W.: I was questioning the reference of that site. What site is that, is it credible? If it‘s Wikipedia, it‘s not fact checked.
Kim S.: Randy, please check your site. Next marker TEC, Trustee Election Committee.
Joy H.: I still need TEC delegates from Atlantic South and Pacific North. If you could email them to me, that would be helpful, I do not have them as of today. I need to send emails to verify who will be at the convention for the interviews. There is no slate for Atlantic North, I do not have Atlantic South, I have Midwest, I don‘t have Pacific North, as they have not met yet, I have Pacific South, I have Southwest, no European slate, I have Trustee-at-Large.
Kenny W.: Where do they come from?
Joy H.: Check with Lawrence. I also need the office slate. European Region, your assembly is when?
Russell S.: Mid-July.
Terry M.: Ours is April 8.
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Kenny W.: Ours is April 1.
Joy H.: Richard S., I will send the spreadsheet to you.
Richard S.: Motion to suspend the rules to hear a piece of business out of order.
Terry M.: Second.
Kim S.: There has been a motion to suspend the rules to hear a piece of business out of order, by Richard Schafer, seconded by Terry. Is there any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes.
Richard S.: Motion to hear item 2011.03.03 out of order, WSBT ratification, by Richard Schafer, seconded by Terry. Is there any discussion?
Terry M.: Second.
Joy H.: Why would we do this tonight?
Richard S.: To get it out of the way. Before we move into old business.
Joy H.: Thank you.
Kim S.: Any other discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes.
At this time we will address item #2011.03.03, WSBT ratification. To clarify, all director trustees shall be ratified by secret ballot, no less than once per year at a quarterly meeting of the WSBT. Such a ratification vote can be called for at any of the WSBT quarterly meeting by a simple majority vote. At this time, we will vote to proceed with the ratification.
Kim S.: This is a vote to actually do the ratification. We will affirm by going around the room for the record to move forward with the vote.
Peter D.: Yes.
Randy G.: Yes.
Richard L.: Yes.
Robert L.: Yes.
Joy H.: Yes.
Kenny W.: Yes.
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Terry M.: Yes.
Russell S.: Yes.
Richard S.: Yes.
Kim S.: Yes.
I have passed out ballots with a yes and no column for each trustee. For the record, trustee ratification requires a 2/3 majority vote by the WSBT. You must receive seven or more votes to be ratified.
Thank you everybody, for participating in the ratification. At this time all trustees have been ratified. It is now just after midnight. What I would suggest at this time, since we are due to return at 8:00 am tomorrow morning, we close for the evening and commence tomorrow for a two-hour session. After which we will have a Board-to-Board meeting, we break for lunch, and we have DOO interviews. Keep in mind we have to work tomorrow night, and we push our clocks ahead an hour, so we lose an hour‘s work. See you all tomorrow at 8:00 am. Thanks everybody.
Kim S.: Good morning everybody, it is Saturday, March 12, 2011, 8:39 am. We are at the Old Business marker on the agenda, page 5. Marker 2008.04.14 CA Helpdesk site.
Richard L.: Do you want to wait to cover this at the B2B? John should be present to talk about this. Ryan and John have been strong on that.
Kim S.: It is presently on the Board-to-Board agenda, Richard S. or Kenny, do you have anything to add?
Kenny W.: I don‘t have anything to add.
Richard S.: I know that Ryan has not made any modifications or changes yet. It has not been brought back up, though he does know that this is an item of desire, to get this up and running. I am unclear of where this is on his task list.
Kim S.: For the new Trustees, the CA helpdesk site is a site where the Fellowship can go to and look at frequently asked questions, and questions with responses we have previously sent out to the Fellowship, hopefully they will be categorized by different situations, issues and concerns.
As long as I‘ve been a Trustee, this item has been on the agenda. What is most important is it could free up some of our time responding to certain issues if a delegate or member were to go to that site and pull up frequently asked questions, and get their response, get their information before sending off correspondence to us. It‘s something we really want to have Ryan move forward on.
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Item #2009.12.03, Facebook pages reflecting tradition violations and policy issues regarding CA logo, website address, etc. These are with respect to the cease and desist. Kenny, do you have any update for us?
Kenny W.: There were a couple of sites at the last quarterly that I sent a couple of links to Richard S., since then there have not been any new developments on that toward that end. He did send me the information I need, the letter, but I haven‘t seen any violations that we need to be on top of. However, we did get some memorabilia that somebody had been selling on the internet. We haven‘t taken any action that yet. I‘m not sure, it looks real similar to what we‘re…I don‘t think the logo was used with the Hope, Faith and Courage was definitely used, it has the look and feel of ours, but no action has been taken on that.
Kim S.: It was something I was sent by a member of the Fellowship, it is a logo that is up for sale, again, it does not include the CA, but it includes Hope, Faith and Courage incorporated into the artwork, certainly that is a violation of our copyright, trademark and traditions.
Terry M.: One of the emails I got, there are a few pages that have How It Works posted on the websites, I don‘t have those websites, I can probably get them. We probably need to inform them they need to take those down.
Kim S.: If anyone is online, have a free moment to search out, and find something that is a violation of our copyright, trademark or traditions, please forward it to Kenny, myself, and Richard Leve so we are in the loop and can follow-up on that. Please include Richard Schafer, as secretary, so he is aware of how that is progressing. Another thing, at your assemblies, utilize your Fellowship. Tell the delegates, you are the delegate to an area, monitor your district and area websites, if you‘re friends with someone on Facebook and see they are using any of our logos, send it to Kenny so it can be discussed at this Board, then at the Board-to-Board.
Terry M.: I will follow-up and find out which particular websites he was talking about, we probably need to address that.
Kim S.: It is not expected of Richard Schafer or Kenny to sit home and monitor the world wide web, so if you find a link, send it off so it can be followed-up on.
Richard S.: Terry, some sites still have How It Works on them?
Terry M.: Yes, the CA version.
Richard S.: If you keep Kenny in the loop on that and copy me that would be great.
Terry M.: It was in the letter we received from Canada that said there is CA websites that have How It Works on it as CA approved literature.
Richard S.: It sounds familiar, I‘ll take a look at it. I think I was focused on the Facebook activity.
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Kim S.: Based on the statement issued by this Board, the CA version of How It Works is not CA approved literature. That is how the context would be, if it is being written that it is CA approved literature, it would be a concern, as opposed to just putting up the CA version of How It Works.
Kenny W.: I think all CA sites have the CA version of How It Works.
Group: No.
Richard S.: I sent out messages to any that I found when this first occurred. If you look at the websites from ca.org, any that were there were requested to take it to the IT Committee, over a year ago.
Russell S.: Just Googling it, Cocaine Anonymous How It Works, CA Arizona has got it on their website, Illinois CA as well, Minnesota.
Kim S.: Illinois Area‘s website does not have it on their website.
Richard S.: It needs to be looked at further, it could be archived, Google archives it, it may not be what is live on the page.
Russell S.: I apologize, looking further, the How It Works letter is what comes up.
Richard S.: The best course of action is to check the sites in your region, report back to Kenny, copy me, sometimes things come back up after they come down. Just keep an eye on the websites in your region.
Kim S.: The Google websites do not have the CA version of How It Works, for clarification. We should all be aware of that.
Richard S.: Before a quarterly comes up, if you can run through your region‘s websites, send anything you find off to Kenny, send a copy to me. We can tackle it prior to our arrival here rather than in the middle of the meeting.
Kim S.: Anything else on this item. Next item is #2010.05.03, CAWS 2011. Follow-up regarding the insurance waiver.
Richard L.: This item can be deleted. The WSO is not going to take a position on it, any outside…if you‘re taking the pink jeep tour, you‘re taking the pink jeep tour. Have fun, enjoy yourself.
Randy G.: I would like to leave the update, we only have one more telephone call, then the meeting in Phoenix. Can we leave this on the agenda I‘ve got to go over?
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Kim S.: Can that be addressed at the Board-to-Board under 2011, and take it off of our old business? Do you have any updates?
Randy G.: Yes, it can be removed, everything outstanding can be covered at the Board-to-Board.
Kim S.: Next item is #2010.08.09, 7th Tradition monies from abroad.
Russell S.: With the 2012 activity, it‘s been a wonderful playground to check out the money movement issue both ways. There have been some recent challenges, which have highlighted some of the issues, I don‘t believe this is unique in international money transfers. Checks being sent to the office with no cover letter. We‘ve had a local issue within the region, that‘s been a bit messy. At the moment, I don‘t have a lot to expand on. The office has been working on user-friendly ways of moving money from foreign currencies. We found a healthy solution to something that happened recently, this will be expanded upon in the Board-to-Board.
Kim S.: We are okay with movement of the 7th Tradition from international…
Russell S.: There has been an area locally that has highlighted some other areas that may need to be looked at into safe movement of monies. I would like to have this remain on the agenda, please.
Kim S.: Absolutely. I have a question. Are we current with the confirmations of 7th Tradition money with the exception of the local issue? We had some question whether or not monies were received, whether confirmations for those contributions, the letter of acknowledgement sent to those donors were sent.
Russell S.: Any monies currently being sent to the office are getting a letter sent back to them thanking them. We are clearing up some of what went on previously, it has been challenging for John. I think he talked about it yesterday, just the way donations were entered into QuickBooks improperly.
Kim S.: This item will remain on the agenda for updates with respect to international movement…
Russell S.: No.
Kim S.: Is there something new? I understand we are utilizing some new means of depositing money and getting it moved. The middle bank, the CAWS 2012 is not listed at a CAWSO account, this is to be discussed at the Board-to-Board meeting.
Russell S.: Unless you would like to move it to International Structure and Development?
Kim S.: Can this be removed from our agenda and leave it on the Board-to-Board?
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Richard L.: That‘s exactly what _________________, and then we can come back to it here after we‘ve had our discussion with the Board-to-Board, after we are more informed.
Kim S.: This is more an issue for the Board-to-Board, as it will involve the ongoing accounts, the PayPal, Zoom, or any other accounts we anticipate opening with respect to the Convention.
Richard L.: If we need to tweak it here, we can do so.
Peter D.: Does that have anything to do with the money that was missing over there or is that a different issue?
Kim S.: No. That is a different issue. Those are some of the challenges we were discussing with respect to acknowledgement. That issue is being dealt with between the local area and the office.
Peter D.: Are we going to get involved with that or will the results come to us?
Kim S.: It‘s between the local area and the office. The office is handling acknowledgments and allowing the area to address it so we are mindful of our own traditions and concepts.
Item #2010.09.01, status of the WSO. We do have interviews starting today at 1:30, I ask that you be here between 1:00-1:15 pm, ready to go. I believe we have the resumes and questions to hand out. That is the status as of now. Hopefully we will confirm someone as the Director of Operations this weekend, they will be allowed to go through a transition with John Bodkin and get up to speed. I‘m certain there will be discussion of this at the Board-to-Board. As you are aware, Sheila is there, we have recently done some online business regarding her salary. We have Andrew, according to John, he is doing a stellar job. Anything else?
Richard L.: The bookkeeper.
Kim S.: We have a new bookkeeper, he comes in one day a week and is doing very well.
Robert L.: A volunteer or paid employee?
Richard L.: He is paid, I think he comes in for about six hours. He‘s only come in three or four times so far.
Joy H.: He is the CALA treasurer.
Kim S.: He is the CALA treasurer, and employed at the CAWSO office?
Joy H.: Yes, one day a week. I don‘t see a conflict.
Kim S.: I do, generally, all of our employees are asked to step away from other commitments. Once you are employed by the office, you come under certain scrutiny, and doing service work
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outside that can potentially cause scrutiny on the office. Maybe under this agenda item on the Board-to-Board, we should discuss that as well.
Randy G.: Is it written anywhere, or assumed?
Richard S.: It‘s been discussed, I‘ve never seen it written.
Kim S.: I think in the guidelines it may say that under DOO and DRPD, as well as DAL‘s.
Richard L.: Those are volunteer positions, not paid positions.
Randy G.: I ask, because if it‘s not written, we ought to come up with a position before we go into a Board-to-Board and find ourselves debating against each other.
Kim S.: With respect to office employees doing service positions within the Fellowship.
Russell S.: Office staff are employees, if at times the unhealthy influence they can have or__________________ can be scrutinized…I feel uncomfortable in paid employee for CAWSO
being told what they can or cannot do to apply to their lives in order to recover from their addiction. Service is part of what we do. Another issue I feel uncomfortable with taking somebody on as a paid staff member, just a job, is telling them you can‘t do service, you can‘t do local area service. It is interfering with somebody‘s recovery program.
Kim S.: That would be a suggestion, as it is suggested we step away. I understand we are not paid employees. No one is requesting anyone stop doing the most basic, the most truly needed service work at this Fellowship, which is to go to a meeting. That is where service work starts. I am trying to express to you all is, especially with Michael, being the treasurer of CALA, not just doing service work, it could potentially be a conflict, handling money in two different separate situations. It may be what Sheila is doing, potentially does not have as much concern.
Robert L.: The way I look at it Russell, if they are a paid employee, they are a special worker, they fall under the World Service work for the Fellowship. In a whole different sense. They are still doing service work. What we are trying to do is keep them out of the area or district, so there‘s not a potential conflict because of the scrutiny Kim was talking about. There are a lot of positions, we‘re talking about areas and districts, but there are a lot of other service work, going to meetings, being a sponsor, showing up. Those are the most important, this is. One addict helping another is the basis of our service work.
Richard S.: If, for example, if John B. were a trustee and employed as the office consultant, would you see that as a conflict?
Unknown: Yes.
Richard S.: Then where do you stop, where do you draw the line? It‘s difficult, there are issues for conflict.
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Terry M.: I‘m not quite sure how I feel about this, one of the things that should be clear, the bookkeeper doesn‘t have access to our bank account, correct?
Joy H.: Correct.
Richard S.: You mean access as to payments and checks?
Terry M.: Yes. I don‘t see a conflict in entering numbers, he doesn‘t have access to writing checks if they want to be illegal. I see it as entering numbers, I personally don‘t see a conflict in that. He probably can sign checks on CALA, as for the office, he doesn‘t have that power. Something about the best qualified person to suit the job. It sounds like this guy is on top of everything, I need to look at it as an overall picture. No matter who is in what position, so I‘m not quite sure how I really feel, I don‘t believe it is a conflict, he‘s entering numbers.
Kim S.: Maybe we shouldn‘t be as concerned as CALA. This is not about Michael, I don‘t know this person, and I am speaking in generalities. I am the treasurer for CALA, I do the books at the World Service Office. CALA makes a nice donation, which never makes it to CAWSO account, but I have the ability to make it look like it did. Not because I can get into any account numbers, however, I can get into QuickBooks and say CALA made this donation. I am just giving you a scenario. We think of this stuff as it won‘t happen. If any one of you has a moment this weekend, talk to Russell, his concerns and his local area, about how this potentially happens. Although I know we have the responsibility as matched by equal service authority, I think we must be mindful of potential harm that can happen. I‘ve been around for long enough to know, this stuff happens. It happens at the top, the GSR, the literature guy who leaves with all of the literature when he went out to use, what‘s he doing, selling CA books in the crack house? This is not about this individual, it‘s about the potential liability, being aware of it, protecting the individual, not just CA.
Richard L.: I did not know that, I do not know the man, Michael. We can ask Tom or John, I didn‘t even know he worked for CALA. I just know they brought in an accountant, I believe he is a CPA. I am not trying to defend this man. He had qualifications, he came into the office and doing it. That‘s all the knowledge I had to bring you.
Kim S.: I appreciate the office finding him, bringing him in, and putting him in place. We do need it.
Richard L.: The former bookkeeper, he had our stuff off premises, or he was keeping odd hours.
It was the worst accounting, you can see how it went. We are trying to fix something broken.
Kim S.: I understand and appreciate that.
Richard L.: Milwaukee showed a 50% larger net gain than what was actual. We are trying. Sheila is doing most of the entry, as you hear reporting, and the DOO. When we are interviewing the DOO, somebody with accounting skills to pick up that slack.
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Peter D.: This seems to be in our guidelines, some vague suggestion of who does what, how, when. This coming up, we should go and hire, I‘m sure there‘s a hundred accountants or bookkeepers we can bring in once a week to avoid something like this. That scenario was awesome. You can write a check for $3,000, put it in his pockets, CALA…Down the road someone finds out. That‘s good larceny, and I can see it happening in a heartbeat. Is this a referral, to clear up the terminology?
Kim S.: I believe this would be for the policy, we would set the policy and the office would put through the procedure. Is that correct?
Joy H.: Yes.
Richard S.: This discussion should happen with the Office Board.
Randy G.: I am against the idea of limiting paid employees efforts. Potential for embezzlement is a risk that is there in the financial procedures of CALA are responsible for that, not us. The chance to put into our books a deposit that would not be found as never being made is a reconciliation effort the World Service Office already has in place, it doesn‘t go without the individual‘s ability to do that whether he wrote it from CALA or wrote it from…his opportunity to write a check to himself and cash that check cannot be covered up by posting it in QuickBooks if the deposit never makes into an account. I don‘t see that the potential embezzlement of a treasurer should preclude them from working for the office. That‘s kind of what I‘m hearing. The treasurer of CALA inside of whatever guidelines they have, if it doesn‘t include checks and balances to keep that person from writing themselves a check. That‘s the problem of CALA. Because he‘s employed at the World Service Office does not give that person an opportunity to hide that embezzlement. It might take time to find it, no different from CALA‘s risk of the treasurer writing himself a check that would take the time to find from their end. Policy, procedure, and decision making, there is a potential for that scrutiny, check writing, I think there are positions at the office that it is just like the position of trustee that I‘m comfortable asking them to step away from other roles in Cocaine Anonymous. Traditional standard employment, a secretary, the guy in the warehouse, the bookkeeper that does not have the check writing capability, I do not see that as an issue.
Richard S.: I need to make a correction, or a statement. Randy, you said that it can‘t be covered up. It absolutely can be. It‘s bookkeeping software, not accounting software, Joy can tell you the difference. Bookkeeping software can be manipulated, it‘s absolutely possible. Unlikely, and with a lot of great length, yes. However, it can be manipulated forever. You can make a notation, clear a field and say this was an error. It‘s absolutely bookkeeping software, not accounting software, which cannot be manipulated.
Joy H.: Yes, QuickBooks can be manipulated, there are safeguards to make sure that once books are closed they can no longer be manipulated. I believe someone working in the office six hours a week, I‘m not sure if he‘s run payroll, I don‘t see him being under salaries, it‘s more under bookkeeping, there is possibility it is a 1099 for his pay. I am kind of on the fence whether we should tell him he can‘t work there, whether we should tell the Board they need to find someone else or not. My opinion is, as the concept say, each service responsibility should be matched by
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an equal service authority. I am not sure we should tell this man, sorry, you can‘t work for CAWSO because you‘re the treasurer of CALA, or the other way around. I do know that CALA has very strict guidelines with respect to their treasurer, who does all of their books on QuickBooks. He is very well versed in QuickBooks, also with the number of eyes on the financial statement, and with us having more access to them, at least in the next 18 months, any irregularities would be found quickly. I‘m still on the fence as to how we should direct the office regarding hiring someone who has a service position in the area. I am undecided.
Richard L.: If this guy was paid to clean and vacuum the office, would we be having the same discussion. He‘s an accountant, I‘m sure he is licensed and bonded. He‘s not touching checks. He‘s entering data. Sheila and John are doing the banking. There is a system, we can question when Tom, John, and Barry are here, what the procedures are. We can continue this conversation about that. If we are asking somebody with professional skills to come in for six hours one day a week to help do something who is a professional, we should honor that, if he is volunteering at a different level with a group, would we be having this discussion if he was working with NA or AA? I think it is a discussion that should be taken to the limited Board-to-Board. We can debate it afterward.
Richard S.: I believe 50% of this discussion is out of order. I have said it before, this lies with the Office Board, and we task the Office with finding individuals to perform the tasks. It‘s not about us telling or instructing them what to do, if there is no policy in place, we may want to review our policy and have a discussion with them. However, this is where this lies.
Kim S.: In five months, I‘m gone, in 18 months, you‘re gone, in five months John Bodkin is gone. In four years, we‘re all gone. From my experience, I‘m not trying to be punitive to anyone who wants to do service work at the WSO, it is a safeguard. I can tell you probably every single region has had an issue. It‘s probably, more of a money issue as opposed to someone who edits a newsletter. Despite the guidelines, policy, procedure, the overseeing, things happen. We got here, checks were handed out, and half of them didn‘t have a second signature on them. That is policy, and a very innocent mistake. Nevertheless, mistakes happen whether they‘re innocent or intentional. That is my concern. I really object to anyone saying it‘s not our job. It‘s not our job to put in potential safeguards for CALA? Because that‘s what we do every year at conference, that is our job. It is my job to get somebody to a meeting, it‘s my job to have the guidelines in place to potentially protect every member of this Fellowship. We have the best people in place to guide us through that. We are administrators, not just financial planners. I agree, we need to explore this and, Randy, you set this off with a desire to set policy. That is where we are now. This will go forward to the Board-to-Board for further discussion, make suggestions.
Randy G.: I don‘t know if I desire to set policy, but take a WSBT position, I don‘t know what that is, if we have one. I don‘t know if it is our job to tell CALA how to do their financial checks and balances. We can suggest…
Kim S.: I didn‘t say that, I said suggest.
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Randy G.: I apologize. Without a motion on the floor, I think the discussion has been good, at some point in time, things are what they are. I am not comfortable with taking a position at the Board-to-Board unless we want to formally make a motion to decide how to do that. We can tell them that we recognize there is an employee who holds a service position. I am not comfortable here without a motion and a vote as presenting a Trustee position regarding that recognition.
Richard L.: I would like to table this discussion until after the Board-to-Board, when we are more informed, get some of these questions answered, and then return to discussion. I would like more information.
Randy G.: If it comes up in the Board-to-Board, then what?
Richard L.: I still feel this Board needs to make a decision on it. Table this to a later time? Is that appropriate?
Randy G.: My only fear is that it will become a Board-to-Board motion.
Richard L.: I feel I would like to ask some questions of Barry, Tom, John. Kim brought up she won‘t be here soon, others won‘t either. I‘ve seen this go on. I understand the need for safeguards, I hear Richard very well. If it is a matter of wanting to place policy, I want to gather some information first, then continue the conversation, then if we have to make policy, a suggestion, then we can do that. As of now, I am not ready to make an informed decision.
Peter D.: I have just come to realize John is taking care of the office, he is really good at it. He hired this guy, it obviously did not come to mind it might be a problem. We can sit around and talk about it, the scenario you brought up was outrageous, and could happen. I don‘t think John thought it, or anyone in the WSO thought that. So Kim brings it to light, there is a good possibility it could happen, and we are just saying, no, just let it go? Then when it does happen, if it does happen. So why don‘t we talk to the World Service Office and bring that scenario to John and say hey did you ever think maybe? Then discuss it, and if you gotta put a policy in place and make a suggestion, let the World Service Office be aware. Obviously they‘re not thinking that thought, I have a fairly larcenous mind, that‘s amazing. John never thought about that, I don‘t think anyone did. So it came to light here, we can‘t just say forget about it, don‘t do anything about it. Let‘s talk to John and see what…that‘s a good way to prevent something from happening so next year we don‘t sit down and go ____________________ and the shit does happen.
Terry M.: I was on the fence, I think I jumped on one side now. This isn‘t about the treasurer , bookkeeper position. It‘s about everything that goes on at the office. I think part of what I‘ve realized in service is there‘s not much, we always have tons of stuff that goes on in meetings and there‘s no great documentation, or somebody loses something. I think something, a policy can‘t hurt. I don‘t know if I‘m ready to, it‘s not about what somebody thinks. My experience is when something has happened in my Fellowship, it is because I wasn‘t willing to address something that makes me feel uncomfortable. Then when it happens, I want to point the finger at everyone else but I‘m the one to blame because I am the one who felt uncomfortable and I didn‘t say
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anything. I don‘t think it‘s a bad idea to put some policy in place, and I don‘t believe it‘s whether the Office Board wants us to or not. I think it may be our responsibility.
Kim S.: I think the next course is to pursue discussion with the WSOB and get some input, their thoughts, so we can come back here and discuss it further, we can make some decisions, either a policy or we allow things to continue as is. Is everyone agreeable to that? Let the discussion take place with no decisions or motions taking place at the Board-to-Board. A discussion of concerns. Richard S.: Regarding status of WSO, I would like to know where we are with the interviews for directors, that has been going since before the DOO search.
Richard L.: That will be happily pursued after this quarterly. We have a few individuals, since we‘ve been working on the DOO, those people will have their interviews s a week from Thursday. We have one, possibly two strong candidates to fulfill those positions. We will bring those to you.
Randy G.: There was discussion at one point in time, one of the individuals from prior efforts might be asked to reengage. Did that happen?
Richard L.: That‘s an also possibility, yet. We might be able to complete this at our next board meeting.
Kim S.: With respect to the task the WSOB has been under since the last quarterly, that was to put out the job for the DOO, review resumes, and interviews, that hasn‘t been a priority.
Richard L.: Yes, our days have been filled with DOO interviews.
Richard S.: I just wanted to have it on the record.
Kim S.: The next item is #2010.10.05, the CA Website service page, that is the CAWS Conference Committee Statements of Policy. That is the Conference Committee Statement of Policy. I‘ve asked everyone to review their statement of policy Conference Committee Statement of Policy with respect to what is in the World Service Manual. If there are any discrepancies, you were to let Richard Leve or the Office know so he can ensure that change is made.
Richard L.: Nothing so far.
Kim S.: I believe everything has been updated. I believe Archives has their own service button, I think at this time we can safely remove this from the agenda. As a liaison between our conference committees and what is going on at the office and website, it is our responsibility of make sure what is going on, or at least put a word out to the Chairs of those Conference Committees and ask for their due diligence to make certain everything is correct. Let‘s take a 10-minute break and return for the Board-to-Board at 10:00 am.
Kim S.: Good evening everyone, it is 7:18pm, pacific standard time, Saturday, March 12. We are returning to the WSBT agenda table with a full day of work. Following the Board-to-Board
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meeting we broke briefly and went into interviews for Director of Operations. Following that, we broke for dinner. We return now on agenda of old business, Item #2010.12.02, HFC sales in the US regarding stickering of the books. I know we touched on this briefly before we broke earlier.
Richard S.: I know where we left off was just at old business.
Joy H.: We talked about Statement of Policies.
Richard S.: I apologize, I‘ve got it. We are at that item, 2010.12.02, we are ready to go on that item.
Kim S.: Regarding stickering, we were going to continue on this item or, based on information we received at the Board-to-Board meeting.
Joy H.: I make a motion to suspend the rules to consider an item out of order.
Richard S.: Second.
Kim S.: We have a motion to suspend the rules to consider an item out of order, by Joy, seconded by Richard S. Is there any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed. Motion passes.
Joy H.: I make a motion to go to Item 2011.03.04 under new business, hire ratification of DOO.
Richard S.: Second.
Kim S.: There has been a motion to hear, out of order, an item of new business, Item #2011.03.04, the hire and ratification of the DOO, made by Joy, seconded by Richard S. As I stated for the record, we did complete the interview process of four candidates that were brought forth by the WSOB. All those in favor of hearing this item at this time? All those opposed? Thank you, motion passes.
At this time I would entertain the motion to go into Executive Session.
Joy H.: I make a motion to go into Executive Session.
Richard S.: Second.
Kim S.: I have a motion to go into Executive Session, to discuss this item number, by Joy H., seconded by Richard S. Any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes. It is approximately 7:22 pm pacific standard time, we will go into Executive Session to discuss this item of business.
We are back online, it‘s 10:44 pm, pacific standard time, we have just returned from Executive Session, with the discussion of the candidates for DOO. A decision has been made to put forth our selection from the WSBT regarding a hiring of a DOO. I will be making a phone call to Tom
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Phelan and giving him our decision, we will move forward based on the continued process of the hiring. With that, we will move back to our agenda. Item #2010.12.02, HFC 2 sales in the US regarding the stickering of the books. This is with respect to follow-up with the subcommittee, we did have a short discussion during the Board-to-Board meeting with regard to the letter, which we will forward to the office. Joy will you take care of that?
Joy H.: Do you want me to send it to Richard L. again? Yes I will forward it to him again.
Kim S.: Joy will forward the letter that was approved by both Boards to be put forward to the Fellowship. She will forward that letter to Richard Leve, Richard will then forward that letter to the WSO for distribution to the Fellowship via an addendum to the Delegate Mailing. Joy, is there anything else regarding the ad hoc committee you would care to address at this time?
Joy H.: Terry, would you like to add anything?
Terry M.: Do we need to restate that these minutes? About which part? Me and John were working, John had sent me the pdf file, I looked at it to see if it was editable, the very last printed piece. And it is. We had a little discussion about the cost of getting it re-typeset, the reason we are looking at whether it‘s editable or not was that professionally I do that stuff for a living and I offered my services if was approved to just make the changes, although I didn‘t want the responsibility of getting the corrections right, or proofreading the corrections, but I can do the corrections and all that stuff in a short period of time and save the Fellowship some money. I would do that on a professional level, whether I was a Trustee or not. I would offer my services for that. Anyway, the pdf was editable, I haven‘t done anything to it, and I won‘t do anything to it until your advice, it was okay with all parties involved. It was just something to look at so we don‘t have to pay $3,000-5,000 to get it re-typeset and rearranged. Also we talked about some ways of working on the inventory and I have some things jotted down that we talked about. I will be posting those to the ad hoc committee to start hashing them out and seeing if any of them are good ideas or not. So hopefully the ad hoc committee is going to be busy in the next month or two trying to go through some of those things. That‘s about where we‘re at.
Richard S.: That is HFC 2 you are speaking of, the pdf format?
Terry M.: Yes, and actually we have the pdf in both the Canadian English and the American English.
Richard S.: The one you are discussing editing is the?
Terry M.: Currently the, actually they all need to be edited, but the only one I looked at was the American English.
Richard S.: In the Board-to-Board, weren‘t we talking about the French one being edited?
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Terry M.: The French one is, that was the discussion of do we need to make changes and no, I cannot edit the French, basically because I don‘t know French. Correcting the Canadian English and American English is possible.
Peter D.: Is there a big difference between Canadian English and American English?
Terry M.: Some words, yes. Spellings are different, I am not sure about interpretations.
Randy G.: There is a Canadian-English translation?
Terry M.: I‘m pretty sure that‘s what it said.
Unknown: That‘s the International version.
Terry M.: I haven‘t looked at it, it could be. That was also, whichever one that was, was also given from RR Donnelly. Actually in the printing business we do two different English‘s. We do a Canadian English and an American English. We print stuff for both languages all the time. The same documents with words that are just spelled British. It‘s not uncommon for me to see Canadian English in anything.
Kim S.: Mr. Schafer, do you have notes regarding this?
Richard S.: I do, everything I have referenced is with respect to the French, which was the topic we discussed.
Terry M.: We talked about the translation, and later HFC 2 was talked about.
Richard S.: French translation, HFC 2, how long does it go to print, John; Morris Publishing, dependency on the pdf edit ability, etc., approximately eight weeks.
Joy H.: That is regarding the English version.
Terry M.: That‘s regarding the French version.
Group: French.
Terry M.: We also talked about the English version…
Joy H.: At the same time.
Richard S.: We were under the item of the French, I am just telling you the notes I took, we were under the item of the French translation, John; formal French, that was the only thing we were discussing. That is why I was asking, for clarification on my note taking right now.
Joy H.: Under the HFC subcommittee, further up, what do you have besides the letter being added to the amended Delegate Mailing?
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Terry M.: Have done nothing to the file yet.
Joy H.: We know it is editable.
Richard S.: Yes it is. It‘s right here.
Terry M.: This is different, this is HFC sales in the US, I‘m not even in this conversation, go back up to the other one. This was the HFC sales in the US and this is where we talked about the editable file I got. It is not about the French, this is about the stickering of the books, it‘s two different…
Richard S.: When John was talking about, it is recorded, John was talking about the tradition, what the issue is with the word, that‘s why I asked what was editable, what that one word was…
Terry M.: This pdf, we do not even have possession of, I‘ve never seen it.
Richard S.: I would like to correct our notes…
Terry M.: This pdf, we were talking about HFC 2, from Donnelly…
Richard S.: Terry has two pdf‘s from RR Donnelly.
Terry M.: Actually I have more than that.
Richard: Do you have more than that?
Terry M.: I have covers.
Richard S.: Right, but two publishing‘s?
Terry M.: I have the two books, yes.
Richard S.: And the two publishing‘s you have are both English.
Terry M.: Canadian English and English.
Richard S.: PDF publishing.
Randy G.: Canadian English has not been changed outside of it does not have How It Works?
Terry M.: I‘m not even sure if the Canadian English has How It Works or it doesn‘t have, I don‘t know how old that file was, it was a file that they sent, there was like six different files that got sent. The only one I really looked at was the English version to make sure that it was editable.
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Richard S.: So you don‘t know if the Canadian English one is or not?
Terry M.: I‘m pretty positive it‘s probably editable. If they unlocked one document I doubt they‘d lock another one. Usually in our business we don‘t lock documents for customers, that‘s up to them, the personal customer.
Richard S.: We are currently talking about the English version.
Terry M.: Yes.
Richard S.: Thank you.
Terry M.: There has been no action towards that pdf other than looking at it, and it‘s the last printed version, we have possession of it, it‘s the last printed version. The last printed book that we have is the pdf that we have. Which knocks out 40 other pdf‘s that are laying around that nobody knows if it‘s the correct one or not. 40 is an exaggeration, there are a few, some of the stuff, in talking with John, people tried to this with it, and that with it, just resaved the files and stuff like that. My suggestion when I talked to him was to call Donnelly and get the last printed version. At least we have something we can go forward with. It is actually the book we are correcting. Sorry for the confusion.
Richard S.: It might have been me, that‘s why I asked. It just didn‘t flow.
Randy G.: On our agenda here, there is a written report here from the January conference call, the ad hoc committee call. In the future, if you could stay away from ―to give authority to the WSOB‖ to do anything…you can give recommendations. The reason being, I‘m looking here that there is a motion here to give authority to the WSOB to mark down the books a little bit above our cost for large quantities to Hazelden, H&I Committees and PI Committees, and it passed.
Joy H.: That was from a different, I understand. This actually should probably be removed. When we did have our conference call we discussed not changing Conference. The Conference said not to discount for H&I, PI, so that actually got reversed out on our call. We decided that the main thing we needed to do was work on the letter from both Boards regarding the issue of stickering of HFC2, anything that was approved at the Conference, we would not even consider.
Kim S.: This was just included in the agenda as a reference point, it will not be included in any minutes.
Joy H.: This was our January conference call, not the committee‘s January conference call. We went back and wiped it all out when we wrote the letter to the Fellowship.
Randy G.: The WSBT conference call? We never talked about marking down H&I.
Kim S. This is from the ad hoc committee, not the WSBT and their agenda. This is the written report Joy sent to us when we were on our January conference call.
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Joy H.: We talked about it, and it was brought up that the conference, the ultimate authority, took away discounts for HFC 2 with respect to H&I and PI, etc. We did not want to overstep the Conference authority.
Randy G.: I was just reading through it, as the motion passed.
Kim S.: It passed on the ad hoc committee, not this body.
Joy H.: Then it was removed during our ad hoc committee conference call. The most important thing was the letter that we worked on. With the European fulfillment issue, that we, as Trustees are going to talk about, that is another thing we need to wait on. If that happens, we can actually send the books to the UK, where they are stored in a fulfillment center. Then they can print large quantities at a lower price over there. That‘s another item. There is so much involved now, with HFC 2 in the printing in UK and Canada, with the possibility of a fulfillment center, it is another item for the ad hoc committee to undertake. It is another item that needs to be considered.
Randy G.: Got it, I‘m good.
Peter D.: I don‘t know if this is the right question at the right time, but if we‘re talking about books and sales and all that, I had talked to John about this guy, he wants to buy three pallets, he kind of offered $3.00 a piece, does that have to be approved by anybody, or can I just say John go get his $3.00 and sell three pallets?
Randy G.: My own personal opinion, it was a very loud voice at the World Service Conference that we didn‘t put special pricing out for subcommittees, we didn‘t do special pricing, I‘m just very concerned, how do we pick and choose?
Peter D.: This is a vendor, not an H&I Committee. This is a guy who wants to buy books, and is going to sell them or give them away.
Joy H.: They would be stickered.
Randy G.: So this is a contractual sale to a Hazeldenish somebody?
Peter D.: It is somebody who has a lot of money, wants to buy a lot of books to give a bunch away and maybe sell a little bit. But mostly giveaway, from what Russ says.
Randy G.: Well, doesn‘t the office have a process to do that?
Peter D.: Not with these books.
Randy G.: How did the Hazelden contract get set up?
Peter D.: They bought what we were selling them for. I haven‘t seen that.
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Richard L.: They gave this task to Peter because he‘s the WST and it would have to get Trustee approval, so that‘s why it‘s really been thrown in his lap and is being brought before you guys here.
Randy G.: Is this individual a member or a company?
Peter D.: A member.
Russell S.: He is a member, however he is not buying them as a member, rather as a company. What happens with the ____________________, to district and areas, in the UK area, if they sometimes buy literature from him, books, Big Books, he started selling HFC‘s, he runs a number of treatment centers, and intends to give away a lot of Big Books, HFC‘s.
Randy G.: So he‘s a member whose created a business reselling our literature.
Peter D.: Giving away.
Russell S.: Does it matter whether he‘s a member? It‘s a limited company. He‘s buying as a limited company, he‘s buying books, no different than Hazelden.
Peter D.: And he will pay for shipping.
Richard S.: Your question was do I need to bring a book deal to anybody or do I work a price and sell them. My response would be it‘s always we, never a me. You can bring what you‘re negotiating, before anything is finalized, bring it to the Board.
Kim S.: There is also a Trustee Negotiating Committee.
Peter D.: This guy wants this to happen now. What do we do?
Richard S.: Email, phone.
Randy G.: Make a motion right now to a dollar value.
Peter D.: I make a motion to accept $3.00 a book on one or two pallets to sell to Paul _______ in the UK.
Kim S.: Can we get a company name?
Peter D.: Does this really matter?
Kim S.: Yes, you are speaking of negotiating business. Is there a problem putting this into the record.
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Peter D.: I don‘t know, I got an email from John, cause this guy called John, John cannot negotiate this, so he gave it to me. So I asked the guy, tell me what you have in mind, we‘d love to sell you some books. He says who are you? I said I‘m the World Service Trustee, I negotiate the price of the stuff we sell. He said, well I was talking to John. I asked Russell to get in touch with the guy, he came back with the same attitude to Russell, he said why do I have to talk to so many people, I was talking to the guy at the office, I just want to buy some books. Then John sent him an email and then the guy sent an email the night before last, the guy wants to know why he can‘t just get a price and buy some books. I want to buy 2-3 pallets of books, can I? He wants to deal with the office, not me and not him (Russell?). I just know his name is Paul. But before I go further I will get where, who, what, when, all that.
Kim S.: I must call your motion out of order, as you do not have sufficient information to put forth to this table for us to make an educated or informed decision.
Peter D.: Okay, that‘s all I wanted to know. I will get that information. I make a motion we sell
2-3 pallets of books to LACAUK, Ltd. He said he will pay $3.00 a book for 2-3 pallets. We have to determine the amount of boxes of books on a pallet for shipping and he will pay or shipping.
Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: Can you please simplify your motion to remove the underlying debate?
Peter D.: I would like to make a motion that we sell up to three pallets of books to LACAUK.Ltd for $3.00, not including shipping.
Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion that we sell up to three pallets of books to LACAUK.Ltd for $3.00, not including shipping, by Peter, seconded by Joy. Discussion?
Terry M.: I love the idea, I think it‘s great, but our minutes are going to reflect something that says something that looks like it says CAUK. To me, it looks like we are giving the UK a great deal on books and that‘s what people are going to look at when they see it. CAUK, how come you‘re giving them such a great deal and not us? I am just…
Kim S.: Do we know what that stands for?
Randy G.: We are talking about something that looks like an affiliation, I don‘t‘ even know where the problem is.
Peter D.: Paul Reuben, Nap Clean Europe Limited, Institute for Family Business
This is from Paul: I am concerned that (a) I haven‘t heard from you since February, that other people are being drawn into my discussion with you. I understand that you were going to the Board and going to get back to me, but why did you involve Russell Sedman and others.
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LACAUK.Ltd is not attached or affiliated with Cocaine Anonymous in the UK, therefore I would appreciate that any questions you have you address to me directly, either CAWSO want to offload some HFC 2 or they don‘t. If they do, what is the best price you are willing to drop to, as I am looking for a three-time pallets, skids, plus. Paul Rueben, Nap Clean Limited, So that‘s who wants to buy it, I don‘t know, I guess he has another company called LACAUK.Ltd. If we make the paperwork out and make everything to that, since that‘s what‘s on the email?
Randy G.: What‘s this guy‘s story?
Russell S.: This guy is doing exactly what the vision I have for fulfillment center, he is just doing it on his own with another member cause it‘s difficult to try and get chips and books, that‘s why he‘s doing it. He is so effective, districts are now buying their literature from him because he will get you your key rings the next day
Randy G.: Why is he concerned with your involvement in this relationship?
Russell S.: He has a strong character, he wants stuff his way, and he doesn‘t want to get involved in any Fellowship consciences. He would rather do it this way, it‘s working. Here is a price list, he offers chips, metal chips, HFC, Big Books, little Big Books, 12 & 12‘s.
Kenny W.: He just wants to sell literature.
Randy G.: Any other products sold for CAWSO. So he buys at our straight price or he‘s negotiating discounts for all of it?
Russell S.: He buys from the office at normal prices, and sells for what he buys it for. He is not interested on making a couple of Quid on some chips.
Kim S.: He is currently buying from the Office.
Russell S.: He has been for a while. John let me know the sort of inventory that was being shipped out, it‘s substantial.
Richard S.: What is our current sale price to Hazelden per unit?
Joy H.: They stopped buying it, because it was stickered.
Richard S.: What was our last price?
Joy H.: I don‘t believe John gave that information to us on our last call. Motion to table.
Richard L.: Second.
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Kim S.: There is a motion to table, so we can gather as much information as possible to make an informed decision to move forward with a group conscience, made by Joy, seconded by Richard Leve. All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes with Randy and Richard S. opposing.
Russell S.: A couple of questions, do we sell literature to anybody, within reason, to anybody who wants to buy it? The answer I came to was yes. Can an area or a district buy it‘s literature from anybody it wants to? The answer is yes. Therefore, that‘s the conclusion I‘ve come. As much as I don‘t particularly like it, the conclusion I came to is, what this man is doing, there is nothing wrong with it.
Terry M.: I thought this motion was tabled.
Joy H.: I have a point of order. The motion has been tabled, there is no further discussion until we get more information.
Richard S.: I have a 5th Concept.
Joy H.: On a motion to table?
Richard S.: Yes.
Joy H.: I have a question, did he…
Kim S.: He did not vote on the motion.
Richard S.: I did not, I‘m sorry. You are correct.
Kim S.: You did not vote on the prevailing side, so I will not allow a 5th Concept. Thank you Joy, the motion has been tabled pending further information, the WST will get for us.
Peter D.: Can I throw some of that information in that I just found, just to give you a little info? It‘s not going to change anything.
Kenny W.: In order to continue this discussion, it has to be removed from the table.
Peter D.: I want to just tell you about an email I got, I‘m not going to discuss anything.
Richard L.: You are still on the topic. The topic is off the table.
Peter D.: I didn‘t vote to table anything, I just found something, I‘ll sleep better if I just say it and then we‘ll move on.
Joy H.: Can you email it to everybody?
Peter D.: I just…
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Kim S.: I believe we should take into consideration what Russell has said, what Peter is going to bring back to us. This agenda item shall remain on the agenda, at this time, I would suggest we rename it, in the spirit of the ad hoc committee, with reference to HFC 2, is that correct?
Joy H.: Yes.
Richard S.: Can you please restate for the minutes?
Kim S.: This agenda item, 2010.12.02, to remain on the agenda, with a new title, Ad Hoc Committee Regarding HFC 2. Is there any objection to that? Since we have addressed the labeling, stickering through a letter, the current title no longer addresses what the ad hoc committee is doing.
I would like to address this last item of old business before we adjourn for the evening, Item #1101.01.01, and issue of late minutes. This is an item that Russell had under new business, previously. We were leaving this on the agenda. Are we okay with this at this point?
Russell S.: I believe we are, the minutes are going to be made available to us. I believe we‘ve cleared up _______________________ at getting the minutes to us as soon as possible.
Kim S.: This can be removed . For the record, we should be receiving the December quarterly minutes soon, in addition to the Board-to-Board, and of course we‘ve moved online the tabled conference calls, all of which we want to make certain we get approved and move forward for the next Delegate mailing. With that…
The session ends at 11:24 pm. We adjourn for the evening. We will reconvene tomorrow morning at 9:00 am, we are here until 1:00 pm
Kim S.: Good morning everyone, it is Sunday, March 13, 2011 at 9:11 am, we are reconvening after a late night with much discussion. We are moving back to our agenda under Responses to Correspondence Received from the Fellowship. First piece is 2010-05-18. This will continue to be online until Peter brings the information he has been tasked with bringing us.
Joy H.: Yes, thank you.
Kim S.: Correspondence #2011-01-10, Correspondence from Eric, previously tabled. Randy is the lead on that.
Randy G.: I will move on that this week.
Kim S.: That will remain tabled and moved to online. Correspondence #2011-01-23, Follow-up correspondence from Quin. I sent out a proposed response to the group, it is attached to the working agenda.
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Joy H.: Motion to approve the response to #C2011-01-23.
Peter D.: Second.
Kim S. There is a motion to approve the response to #C2011-01-23, by Joy, seconded by Peter. Would someone please read the proposed response into the record?
Peter D.: Dear Quin: With hopes of moving forward, we acknowledge your displeasure with the outcome of the conference floor decision regarding the 6th disclaimer. Nevertheless, a trusted member of this Fellowship and the guardians of the traditions, as the World Service Board of Trustees, we feel we acted in the best interest of the Fellowship in bringing forth the referral addressing the 6th Tradition Disclaimer. The final outcome of the vote reflected the group conscience of the floor. The process did work, it was an us decision. As to your suggestion, thank you, but moving forward, we will continue to use the book to explain how we come to our decisions. It is referenced for you and others to best understand the process we go through and why. Lastly, we understand the human beings referenced in your email. We too, are human beings, doing the business of CA with a great deal of love, respect, and passion. In Love and Service, WSBT.
Kim S.: Is there any discussion?
Joy H.: After 6th on the second line, can you insert ―tradition‖?
Richard S.: I will add it.
Joy H.: Thank you.
Kim S.: Any other amendments? Hearing none, all those in favor of the response? Anyone opposed? Motion passes. Richard will get that corrected so he can send that out. Correspondence #2011-02-14, correspondence from Trevor, which was responded to by individual members he directed his correspondence to by Richard and myself. I thought, as a Board, we needed to address this. Russell, you were the lead on that.
Russell S.: There‘s been a draft sent out on that to Terry, Kim, and Robert. We can review that.
Kim S.: Shall we review that now and move forward with a response? With respect to the response to the Trevor correspondence, I would entertain a motion at this time.
Russell S.: I would like to make a motion we approve revisions to the response to Trevor.
Terry M.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to approve the proposed response, #2 draft, that was sent to all of us, by Russell, seconded by Terry.
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Russell S.: Dear Trevor: Thank you for you letter of concern to the WSBT dated 14th February, 2011. During the December 2010 quarterly, the traditional Board-to-Board meeting the topic of our book, HFC 2 was again on the agenda. The discussion took place regarding book inventory and meeting the current needs of our membership, and the resources available to meet those needs. With cooperation and unity, the participation of both Boards recognized a conscience to stop labeling, stickering books was valid and clearly within the spirit of the Concepts. Concept 11 states: Where as the Trustees hold final responsibility for AA‘s World Service Administration, they should always have the assistance and the best possible standing committees, corporate service directors, staffs, and consultants. The longtime success of our General Service Board will not only rest on the capabilities of the Trustees themselves, it will depend quite as much upon the competent leadership and harmonious association of non-trustee committee members, corporate service directors, executives, and staff members, who must actively carry on AA‘s World Services, their quality and dedication, or their lack of these characteristics will make or break our structure of service. Our final dependency on them will always be great indeed. Far more than most of the Trustees, these servants will be in direct contact with AA worldwide, and their performance will be constantly on view. They will perform most of the routine labor, they will carry on most of our services, and they will travel widely and will receive most visitors at the headquarters. The will often originate new plans and policies. Some of them will eventually become the Trustees. Because this group will form a visible image of World Service, most AA‘s will measure our service values by what they see and feel with them. Members of this group will not only support the World leadership of Trustees in the nature of the case, they will be bound to share world leadership with them. The focus of international literature is a constant priority with our long-term planning and World Service Development, and HFC 2 falls within the scope of that vision. The desire to allow group‘s access to all our literature in all languages at a reasonable cost is sincere and seemingly inevitable, as our Fellowship continues to grow. Cocaine Anonymous continues to mature, develop, and clarify its diversity, and as such, the freedom to allow a former conscience to be changed and allow a new conscience to be observed is wonderfully healthy.
Kim S.: Thank you Russell. There has been a motion and a second, this has been read into the record. Is there any discussion? All in favor? Anyone opposed. Motion passes. The response is approved, it will be uploaded and sent out by our secretary Correspondence #2011-03-04, correspondence from Jean ?, Lead on that is Robert.
Robert L.: Motion to table to online.
Peter D: Second.
Kim S.: Motion to table by Robert L., seconded by Peter D., all those in favor? Anyone opposed? This will be moved online.
With respect to correspondence, let‘s make a commitment to getting these done. I am aware there are several pieces of correspondence in our mailbox, Richard will send that out this week. Let‘s get that out, get the correspondence taken care of. If it is something you can take care of as a Regional Trustee, one-on-one, please just keep the Board in the loop, copy Richard S. and
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myself on that correspondence. If it is sent out to the Yahoo group as a group effort, if you‘re not currently working on something, please step up and help out.
Randy G.: To assist Robert and I in responding to this, I want to make sure I understood what happened at the Board-to-Board regarding the French translation, because the French translation that we have in HFC does recognize, is interpreted to read just cocaine addict. So in the traditions, this individual‘s letter has a valid point. Essentially, this is one of those addict‘s only type letters that we‘re cocaine addict only. It is, because it‘s translated back, I just want to make sure, did I understand that someone is taking on the responsibility to change that translation in the French version of the book of the traditions?
Kim S.: No.
Randy G.: Without doing so, a response to this becomes very difficult.
Russell S.: That is a massive point, because a member is going to refer to conference-approved literature and quote a tradition that is stating his point on this. To respond to this without with responding to that first is to put the cart before the horse, isn‘t it?
Randy G.: Well, we meant it to say this, but it ended up saying this.
Kim S.: Russell, do you think you could help on the response with this?
Russell S.: I would be happy to.
Randy G.: I mean, the response can only be addressed as to our intent, because the literature says otherwise.
Russell S.: That‘s going to be the issue, what‘s our intention around that, because there are two issues, what is our intention around the tradition, I believe unless we have a reference to that, we cannot respond to this, can we. Do we need to explain that we‘ve been wrong?
Randy G.: Or that we are taking action to clean that up. But I don‘t think that we are.
Terry M.: I think most of us are confused as to what action we can take. According to the Conference, they said…
Richard S.: My recollection, and I‘m sure I‘ll be corrected if I‘m incorrect. When John was here, and the banter went between John and Robert, the translation, the majority of the Fellowship there believed this translation to be accurate, this is a minority member‘s view. This does not invalidate it, but the majority of the Fellowship approved and continues to approve it, is that not accurate? That is the discussion we had.
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Robert L.: I haven‘t talked to Yves, who does a lot of the translations for the Fellowship. What we got was a Google translation of the letter. The letter doesn‘t flow right when you read it. I want to talk to Yves and see if he can give us a better interpretation of the letter.
Richard S.: I use three different translators when I translate, it is very useful not to use just one.
Richard L.: My experience has been when I first sat on this World Service Board, back in 1985, and we were talking to AA at the time, the World Service Office then, I spoke to Marilyn, she explained that the French, she told me the story of when they were trying to do the AA Big Book in French, it took them five years to translate it, three of the years the Conference fought over the word trudge because there is no French translation for the word trudge. It‘s always stuck in my mind, for a long time. Recently sitting on translations, at the WSOB level, prior to coming on here, and of course sitting next to Elizabeth when I was going through it, we‘ve gone through translations, and we use an outside professional translator, and of course for the pamphlets, we send it back to the area, and the area decides what it wants to do, because the area. Like Reaching Out in Spanish, the pamphlet, the translation means, to take. Our English version says Reaching Out, in Spanish it means to grab. That area does that. I am sure they‘re probably going to have a debate on the word cocaine addict. I‘m really not giving an answer, I‘m just throwing out information on that, it‘s going to have to go back to the area, the area‘s going to have it, it‘s going to be those, that or going to be debate if they‘re not happy with it, or one member‘s feeling on it. The same goes, Richard S. is absolutely correct, that if you Google it, and use another search engine, and another one, you might come up with three different answers. Even Richard said that one the Board. We had Memo and somebody else, he was doing some Spanish translations. We had three different translators, a member, a non-member, and whatever it is in Spanish. It is difficult to do translations, but it goes back to the group. But, this may be what they call a housekeeping issue and the group‘s going to have to deal with it. Of course, with the French, which we had our little conversation here, we had a Canadian French, and we have a European French. And that‘s always going to be an issue. I think I just stirred the pot a little bit.
Randy G.: If it recognizes that our first step and our third tradition added the sentence ―and all other mind-altering substances.‖ The problem exists if you go to the last paragraph of the individual‘s letter, is that the 5th Tradition still reads cocaine addict. In the English version, the word cocaine was removed and it just says addict. Then when you get into the all other mind-altering substances and the inclusiveness, you can argue that the addict has this widely encompassing…So their 5th Tradition in the French version is still using cocaine before addict. So if we‘re going to respond, we are taking some action to have that word removed. I‘m confused as to how to actually answer him if we don‘t show him that we‘re taking a response to making some effort at having it removed.
Peter D.: I have a question. We are here to serve the Fellowship and I could imagine this letter, if we did take, if that was to change, take cocaine addict out of it, and put addict, somebody‘s going to write why was cocaine addict taken out of it? When do we stop trying to please everybody?
Group: Never.
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Peter D.: So this could go on forever?
Richard S.: Yes.
Peter D.: When does it stop?
Kenny W.: It doesn‘t, it‘s perpetual.
Terry M.: It stops one place and somebody brings it up again, another group. That‘s why we have the Helpdesk.
Randy G.: We will change literature until it‘s correct.
Peter D.: By whose standards?
Randy G.: By any interpretation, the Conference.
Kenny W.: We keep tweaking it until we get it right, however long it takes.
Kim S.: We, this Board, do not change the tradition, it must go to the Conference.
Randy G.: So we need a referral to S&B, ______________________, I can run with that.
Joy H.: Not S&B, LCF.
Randy G.: That will help, a lot. I am uncomfortable defending something that we recognize as being incorrect.
Russell S.: This is huge, it really is. I believe it is something that when it‘s that time of year, it‘s going to come to, it‘s going to go to the floor. Looking on French websites, CA France has got it, their 5th Tradition is quite specific, and every group has one essential objective, to transmit the message to the cocaine addict who still suffers. Peter is right, it is going to go on and on and on. My suggestion is we start wording a response, and start preparing ourselves to bring it to the floor and presenting it to the Fellowship that this isn‘t to change Cocaine Anonymous‘ identity, we are not the decocaining in Cocaine Anonymous, it‘s just in the spirit of unity. I believe it will come to the Conference.
Joy H.: If they refer to us as addict in the French version, says cocaine addict, then we need the French version to match the English version, and I think as a Board of Trustees should write a referral to chance the 5th Tradition to translate to what the English version is. Ours is addict, we are an all-encompassing Fellowship. It‘s cocaine and all other mind-altering substances. When we write our response, we can put in there that we have written a referral to the Conference to repair our translation from English to French.
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Russell S.: My French is not fluent by any means, but I understand how French is put together and you can‘t just have the word addict, the word sufferer. So you suffer from something. So you cannot just use the word addict, it is a fundamental…
Richard L.: Joy basically said it all. I think we need to make a referral to LCF and the translation committee on it.
Randy G.: Thank you, we were not going to be able to respond without this information.
Kim S.: I think this is something we are going to all have to help out with collectively and be all on board with, it is important. And a touchy subject.
Kim S.: Moving onto in-conference and post-conference referrals. Did anybody response to any of their referrals?
Joy H.: A lot of these TEC referrals are also in S&B, so when the response to the referrals to S&B, I will incorporate, because they are in both S&B and with us.
Kim S. They should not be in two committees.
Joy H.: There are a couple of these that are in two committees.
Kim S.: They were referred to us, so let‘s respond to them as such, if you and I need to work on them, we can. At least the TEC referrals, there are at least 11 of them. Let‘s try to pull them together and collectively respond to them and in an effort to try and reduce the amount of work we have to do in May, please, if you are the lead on a referral, get with your subcommittee and start writing responses. I say this because I don‘t want to be at this table in August and try to cram the responses in that are halfway done with no true effort done in responding, and a rushed effort and our opening report by our secretary.
Richard S.: If no one objects, I will put a reminder on the Yahoo group every two weeks to do our referrals, it will pop-up in mail.
Kim S.: I can copy and paste them into a document and send them to you. I did it as the secretary and sent it out every six weeks. We will continue to work online and push forward to work at the next quarterly.
Randy G.: Russell and I have one. We have a referral address, we emailed it last night. Referral 6482.
Richard S.: I think it reads Russell did it, Randy forwarded it.
Kim S.: The Russian referral.
Randy G.: It was sent out at 9:56 pm last night.
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Kim S.: This is post-conference referrals, it‘s Referral 6482, Russian version of Hope. Randy, would you please read into the record the referral as well as the response?
Randy G.: Referral 6482, Russian version of Hope. The referral reads: I believe that the way in which hope is written on the convention t-shirts and chips is incorrect. The character BI is not a letter, rather it is a modifier to the preceding letter. It is not written in the same size as the entire word, rather it is written smaller than the word and is written post-script. If I am correct, please fix the future printing. Response: The Russian translation Hope, Faith & Courage was sent by members in St. Petersburg directly to a World Service Convention Committee who liaised with the Russian members whilst formatting the Russian logo. Since bringing this to our attention, we have again contacted the group‘s members in Russian and asked them to confirm if any changes are required. We are aware that languages utilize modifiers and umlauts, for examples, have relaxed their requirements for perfect translations as most programs for such translations do not allow for the various specific nature of those. This effort was with a sincere desire to demonstrate our worldwide Fellowship and we hope that the spirit of these actions are noted. On any feedback from the members in St. Petersburg that request changes will be noted and any necessary action will be taken for future projects.
Richard L.: Motion to accept the response.
Russell S.: Second.
Kim S. There has been a motion to approve proposed response to referral 6482, Russian version of Hope, by Richard L., seconded by Russell S., read into the record by Randy. Is there any discussion.
Joy H.: Point of Information. Because it is a referral and no action to be taken, it will be under No Action, however, Response to referral?
Kim S.: Often there is no action taken, but we do respond in consideration of the person that put forth the referral. It is part of the opening report. They are not read into the mike, but a matter of record, based on the report.
Joy H.: Thank you.
Richard L.: Does it then get thrown into the Helpdesk?
Kim S.: Our response to referrals are generally not part of the Helpdesk, have not previously been compiled and put on the Helpdesk, it‘s not a bad idea. Basically, what I have compiled over the last two years are just responses to correspondence.
Richard L.: If someone wanted to ask about translations, they type in translation, Russian, this would pop up in a search.
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Kim S.: It is something to consider moving forward. It‘s all work. All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes. Any other responses? Before we move to new business, I want to note for the record, I have called Tom and advised him of the outcome of our discussion and voting last night with respect to the DOO. I also suggested and advised that there would be a 90 day review with input from the WSBT, that we recommend and advised a reference and background check and skill testing. I asked him to verify the individual be available for Drug Court attendance. I agreed with him as well what we discussed as a start date of May 1, and the one item of business that we need to address, although I gave him a range of salary, he actually wanted us to make an advisement and recommendation. Due to the sensitivity of that I would like to go into executive session at this point before we go into new business at this time, I would like everyone to participate. Moving on to new business. [The tape started mid-sentence]
Back on the record: Agenda item-
2011.03.01 – European fulfillment facility – Russell
Russell S.: The vision is for a storage facility called fulfillment facility. I don‘t want to use the word office because it immediately spins us out into another office, a secretary and all, simply somewhere than can store inventory and somehow facilitate orders being placed with CAWSO and being shipped out from a fulfillment facility somewhere within Europe for two reasons: two limit expenditure for groups, to cut down costs for the groups, and to allow access to stuff in a more timely manner. That is the starting point of the vision. For what it‘s worth, the conversation we had last night regarding a limited company that‘s doing this anyway, it started because of the frustrations and the challenges that are being experienced by some groups within the European Region access to this literature. So that‘s the starting point. It‘s not a new idea, it‘s been discussed and considered among members for a couple of years, there has been input from former DOO‘s, the current consultant is aware, input from shipping clerks. I‘ve put together a document just so you‘ve got a ballpark of the cost, it‘s on the group. It‘s an excel sheet which gives the prices of four companies that offer these sort of services in the UK, what they charge to receive a pallet, what they charge to store a pallet, what they would charge to send out an order. I ask you to have a look at that and consider that it may be solution. Whilst there will inevitably be costs to this, the money saved by areas, districts, and groups within the European region allow them the opportunity to do a number of things. Either buy more inventory to do with what they want, or with the unfortunate situation that‘s just gone on in CAUK, there is a healthy attitude towards donations World Services, they‘ve not been received, unfortunately. The attitude of the membership, we‘re at our prudent reserve, forward the moneys. So money saved on shipping would stay in the coffers and would, if the current attitude, which I would like to think is maintained, would simply would be sent forward as 7th Tradition, thus enabling the Office to somehow be compensated for this European hub office. That is the starting point.
Randy G.: So this is just information only, there is no motion pending at the moment?
Russell S.: I can see there have been a number of points of discussion.
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Kim S.: To reiterate, Russell did send out a spreadsheet with different companies, different price comparisons, fulfillment center options, etc. It was uploaded to the group.
We took a slight pause, as Kenny Williams had to leave for the airport. We will now continue with item #2011.03.01, European Fulfillment Facility. I will allow Russell to continue with his discussion.
Russell S: I have sent the excel spreadsheet again. What we‘ve tried to do here is list the charges and fees that will be incurred for these services. Some charge for some services, some charge for others. There are additional services that can be found, one thing I found out about was inventory. We would likely need to do an annual inventory there. I spoke to a couple of them, they said they do that automatically, annual they take inventory as part of their service, and there is no charge. One issue I would like you to be aware of is at the bottom is that all prices are subject to VAT, which is 20%, that may not necessarily be the case. Our pamphlets and sometimes key rings, yesterday someone discussed this, they are at times considered educational, and therefore do not incur VAT.
Peter D: What is VAT?
Russell S.: Value added tax. When we ship items into the UK, depending on who fills out the form, and it is not getting into the realm of dishonesty here, it is having someone who knows how to code inventory. A book is considered educational, so do pamphlets, and therefore do not incur this tax. 20% is quite a lot. If we are going to incur this, we need to look at it. We will need to know about it first. I‘ve tried to present it with help of others, I‘ve tried to present it so you could have a look and see at the sort of costs.
Peter D.: I know who I‘d use, Richard Bartholomew, he doesn‘t charge for anything.
Russell S.: Well, he does, he charges 8% over invoice. What I‘ve asked John to help me with is to put together a number of random orders from the European Region, what‘s an average sort of order, to put them through this process and see what the cost by using these, and what cost has been incurred by groups when they ship them from our office.
Richard L.: So, why are you bringing this to this Board, but before you answer that, because I think this is more of an area issue. In other words, any area can do what they like. CALA can buy large quantities of books, stuff like that. If they‘re asking for, are you asking the CAWSO to, excuse the word, front you a large quantity, advance you a large quantity, and then as it goes, you‘ll send it back, because to go ahead and do this thing, I feel personally, your area can do what they want to do. If they want to go and buy 1,000 books and 1,000 chips and 1,000 pamphlets, they are more than welcome to, and to keep a facility or a warehouse or a distribution, I know you don‘t want to call it a central office, it‘s not an issue. I think the issue would be if you are asking for an advancement and you‘re asking the World Board of Trustees to support you in asking the WSOB to help advance you these products that you eventually pay back to the Office. My question is, is that what you‘re asking?
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Russell S.: My understanding is different. My understanding is that the World Service Office lists the services it offers. It is my interpretation that in order to offer these services to the groups in Europe, it makes sense for them to have a fulfillment facility of some sort within the European Region. I‘ve looked toward Narcotics Anonymous, they have a hub office in Belgium. It was essential from what I‘ve read and from speaking to them, this is before I was a trustee, as an interfering delegate, they were having these same problems…
Richard L.: I don‘t have an issue with it, I think it would be okay.
Russell S.: I believe it would be unhealthy to go down the route of let‘s advance some literature to some region or an area. I could only begin to imagine what our Fellowship would feel about that, how Canada who also has challenges with shipping, what would happen there? Can you advance us? I don‘t see ―fronting‖ as a healthy thing. I think this needs to be monitored by the World Service Office in order to support the groups in their primary purpose.
Richard L.: That‘s why I‘m trying to figure out why you‘re bringing it to the WSBT, I don‘t see the issue with it.
Russell S.: Because this isn‘t new. I‘m sorry if it is new to you, I‘ve been sending this out for a couple of years now.
Richard L.: But I don‘t see an issue with it.
Russell S.: Let me hear what everyone has to say about it. I would love to hear the support of this Board, and a conclusion of well, it‘s okay there‘s some contract negotiation to go on first, there‘s some more reviews and questions to ask, let‘s engage our World Service Trustee to liaise with myself and start asking some specific questions and doing some work on it. I‘ve asked John to help by bringing forward some random invoices. It‘s not on his priority list, obviously, it‘s just me asking for some invoices. If we can step this up a notch and just turn it into a project, a concept that we‘re willing to continue to move forward with, I believe we can start moving it a little bit up the list. I see it as the future of Cocaine Anonymous as we move around the world. I believe it can be the first of many. I have faith and I have hope that this is a healthy attitude for the Fellowship.
Richard L.: I support you and I yield.
Peter D.: Say we send 1,000 books to England every month, a ballpark figure, in ten different orders. What does it cost us to send each order over there? Correct? As opposed to taking 1,000 books, putting them on a pallet, sending them to Bartholomew‘s, then the orders come from a group to Bartholomew‘s, they send the books out, they get paid, and send the money to us, basically this is what this is all about, right?
Russell S.: As I see it, this is a starting point.
Peter D.: So we don‘t have to ship from here all the time over there.
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Russell S.: We‘ve been talking about sending books abroad. Is this the ideal storage facility? When orders come in, a small order, 200 books. We negotiate an order with the book printer there, it‘s just another option. We can either ask the printer to print the books and send them directly to the area that is asking for them, or we keep them our fulfillment facility maintained with inventory.
Peter D.: I like the idea. So we don‘t have to ship them all the individual orders to England.
Russell S.: Possibly not, but for key rings, we‘ve looked at that in the European Region, they are expensive to do small quantities.
Peter D.: This would eliminate us shipping from Long Beach to England 5-6-7-8-10-15 times a month?
Russell S.: This is why I need other people, to help find out these things. Yes, this would help alleviate large shipping costs for smaller and newer areas, to alleviate 6-8 week wait period.
Peter D.: Makes sense to me. Thank you.
Joy H.: It‘s good to have the discussion here, going through the manual, it talks about what the Office offers, and a fulfillment center is not one of them. I think if we are looking at anything financial in this realm, we should probably look at it, so Peter can negotiate the best possible contract, then it goes through the Trustee Negotiating Committee, so it‘s going to be here anyway. Then we vote on it as an entire board, once it‘s gone through the Negotiating Committee. It will then go back to the Office. In my opinion, it needs to come here first. That‘s what we do, as principle financial planners. This will also affect our budget, but it will lower the income we are going get from shipping, and increase the expense. We need to look at this for budgetary purposes, because it will change our budget, we will have to change our budget to cover this. I am grateful John is helping you do this, which will give us the cost basis information of what it‘s going to take. So thank you.
Randy G.: This is the distribution of and does not, this is regardless of whether the books are printed, whether production of the literature happens there or happens here. This is purely a distribution model expense. I understand from a, I recognize from a wide-spread utilization of an entire European Region that the undertaking may seem best served by being handled by the Office. That‘s probably the way that I‘m leaning. But I also understand what Richard Leve discussed in that our area does pay for a storage unit. New York has their own Central Office, where an area gets together, makes a determination, this is an amount of product we can purchase we buy to take care of volume purchases, our intergroup buys 3-4 months, wait 3-4 months, make a big purchase, bring that into our warehouse, our chips and lit guy swings buy the warehouse and loads up his truck on the way to the area meeting and sells it to all the groups that show up. Then the inventory is put back in his truck and it‘s taken back to the warehouse and waits another month. That‘s our cost, that‘s our area‘s cost to best serve our groups. So I understand the possibility that this could be an area effort, recognizing that the whole region, multiple countries would benefit from doing this probably allows the conversation all the way
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through. As far as permission to do something like this, if the Office deems it‘s not feasible, the opportunity to do this as CAUK absolutely exists and fits within the guidelines and traditions and how people across this country is doing it every day. It would be that area‘s autonomy to decide whether those expenses create a savings that‘s worth engaging. That‘s my opinion.
Richard S.: I‘m concerned that the whole picture has not been presented. My understanding is that the sight, the outlook, the vision for this, is to be doing the printing there, and distributing from there, not solely receiving inventory and distributing. Is that not still the case?
Russell S.: Yes, it is part of it. Whether HFC 2 actually gets printed abroad, which makes sense to me.
Richard S.: It makes sense to me too. My concern is that this is being presented as we would like the authority to receive a big chunk and distribute it over there. The true vision is the fulfillment, production, and distribution over there. I don‘t see the issue with that. I see the benefit for it. I want to be sure the discussion is for what the true vision is. It concerns me that it is being presents as more solely receiving of inventory purchased from the World Service Office and not what we‘d like to do is cut the cost savings out of it completely, because, and one of the things we‘ve discussed is the fact that we have a large inventory of some items. So, I would take that into consideration before saying yes. How will we know that one of our larger buyers is no longer going to be purchasing. It‘s not to penalize anybody, we just need to look at the bottom line on what we have in inventory and what we currently move and are we able to recoup the expenses, would that push out when we can do another run again for another book. All those things need to be considered. I am concerned that the true vision of what this is isn‘t being presented with it. It‘s not just solely a distribution, but the vision is to be an actual production, fulfillment and distribution center.
Richard L.: Thank you Richard, for acknowledging that. But, the truth of the matter is this is not an incurred cost for CA, it‘s CAUK is incurring this cost and whether I like it or not, they can do whatever they want to do per se, as far as if they want to open a facility or do that. And as far as if they want to do a printing of the book, whether I like it or dislike it, that is not on the table or being voted on, and that‘s not happening now, it‘s not happening yet, and I don‘t know if it‘s going to be a Conference thing or a Trustee things, and right now it‘s not about having a facility place. They‘re still going to have to have chips, they‘re still going to have to have pamphlets, and other things. They‘re still going to have to have a facility and right now, currently even though they‘re not printing the books, it‘s going to help liquidate some inventory. Because we do have cash value, and assets. We can use the cash. So, it‘s a start, and it‘s a start. I understand that you…You‘re right, it didn‘t get brought up in the conversation, but that will or will not happen whenever it does happen. Right now we‘re talking about the facility and it‘s not that Cocaine Anonymous has to pay for it per se, the World Service Office doesn‘t have to pay for this facility, this is an area thing, just like if that area made a World Service Office, and the expense that is incurred is going to be added onto their inventory when the expense.
Randy G.: Potentially regional. No area should pay for a regional requirement.
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Richard L.: Yeah, regional. People have central offices where they have to pay for their meetings or whatever it is. We have to pay our rent, because we‘re self-supporting through our own contributions. Whatever the cost is, whatever the additional premium is going to be attached to the literature. But it‘s also keep their literature down. Because right now they‘re paying like $19 for the hard cover of HFC. It‘s pretty high compared to the American version.
Russell S.: I need to clarify now. I am sort of disappointed in my fellows. If you didn‘t read the accompanying documentation, I sent it ten days ago. This is not CAUK. This is a regional project. Please can we clarify that.
[Richard Leve asked that his CAUK reference be stricken, will he have an opportunity to proof, his speaking is difficult to correct…]
Kim S.: For further clarification, this is part of the International Structure and Development Committee of this Board. This is part of the process that started during the term of our previous European Regional Trustee. This is part of the expansion and development, and frankly untried grounds that we all need to be aware of. Whether or not it is actually something we need to take action on is not at issue. What Russell is bringing to us are concerns and thoughts and a desire by this Region to potentially move forward with what is a precursor to eventually having the ability to print your own books. We need to give feedback, whether you supportive or not. The bottom line is, the fulfillment options, book printing, this is where the growth of our Fellowship is right now in this Region. To move forward and give support to, and not just say this isn‘t our agenda item. If I‘m wrong Russell, you‘re looking for our support and input in each step of it, so we do it the right way, for lack of a better word, in their development and expansion.
Russell S.: I‘ve just searched literature, and immediately there are a couple of emails. A couple from Switzerland, a couple from Sweden. For instance: Hi Russell: Hope you‘re doing fine. May I ask who the current literature person for CAUK is so we can reorder some welcome and anniversary chips. That‘s from CA Switzerland. Why aren‘t they going to the Office? Cause it‘s challenging for them, it‘s difficult. There are a number of facets here. There are things like royalty agreements we have in place for pamphlets. Narcotics Anonymous do not do royalty agreements, they print their literature for European use in Europe. They‘ve done so because they want to keep an eye on their money, sorry to say it right now. If that is inappropriate to say.
Randy G.: They do that because of volume.
Russell S.: Another volume is the trade embargo between Iran and America. There are so many positive thing that need to be spoken about that I see being beneficial here. I am not seeing this needs to be done within six months or within my term, I‘m just trying to help us broaden our horizons and see the necessity in my view for us to encourage and support our Fellowship as it continues to grow throughout the world.
Terry M.: I make a motion that we work on the concept in our International Structure to Establish a fulfillment center outside of the US….
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Kim S.: I don‘t mean to interrupt you, other than a motion, we can leave this on our agenda and move it up to old business, in reference to securing that International Structure and Development continues to move through the process with the assistance with the WSO.
Terry M.: The reason why I am bringing that is the comment Russell made, when he goes to the office, it‘s as Russell, a member of Cocaine Anonymous. With the backing of the WSBT to gather information to move this along, it‘s going to help, isn‘t that what you said?
Russell S.: Yes.
Terry M.: Russell going to the World Service Office, there is not the urgency or a priority, and all we‘re doing by putting this as an agenda item on our International Structures is going to give a little bit more weight to what he takes hopefully to the Office to do research and find out what he needs to find out. Is that correct?
Russell S.: Peter‘s just joined International Structure and Development.
Richard S.: Was there a motion recognized?
Terry M.: There isn‘t, I was asking for help in doing that. So, I would like to make a motion to accept the concept in International Structure of a fulfillment center outside of the US.
Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to accept the concept to establish a fulfillment center outside of the US, made by Terry, seconded by Joy.
Terry M.: Would that motion make sure it is on our agenda then?
Kim S.: After the motion is discussed. Motion to accept the concept of establishing a fulfillment center outside the US. Correct? Okay. We will also move this to the Board-to-Board agenda. Is there any additional discussion?
Peter D.: I like the idea of the concept.
Kim S.: Is there any additional discussion that reflects action we need to take?
Randy G.: I would request that, when I look at the excel spreadsheet, I don‘t know what that means, because I don‘t know the quantities. I would request a simple, realistic view that we don‘t anticipate more than five pallets be stored at any one time in our effort to, that we‘re going to have this many books, this many pallets, and that number can be plugged on top of these different charges and truly give us a cost of that fulfillment center for what we anticipate, at least our kick-start use to be.
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Russell S.: I speak in favor of the motion. I think it helps if this Board is recognized as being behind the concept. I think if this motion is successful, it motivates to liaise with the Office, through Peter, he has some experience with shipping, and we can start doing some homework, which we are going to need to do.
Kim S.: All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes. Is there additional action you need from me?
Russell S.: I will liaise when we get back home.
Kim S.: Just to be clear, I‘ve seen one, we have several, but there is one that has not been addressed or heard previously out of order. Item #2011.03.02, WSBT Expense Reimbursement Concerns.
Joy H.: I would like to make a motion to change the WSBT Expense Reimbursement Policy, page 2, Trustees traveling distances of more than 3,000 miles will…change the distance to 2,500.
Robert L.: Second.
Kim S.: Can you please put that in a word document so it can be sent?
Joy H.: I already did.
Kim S.: Can you copy me on that please?
Joy H.: I will forward it to you and Richard S.
Richard L.: Approximately where is 2,500 miles from here in LA? Would it be Texas, New York? Where is that, how far?
Kim S.: Inclusive of where Robert Lyle lives.
Richard L.: Would it be where Kenny‘s at, or would it be…
Robert L.: The east coast.
Kim S.: It‘s not inclusive of, but it would include the region, the east coast. Richard, can you please read the motion?
Richard S.: Motion to change the WSBT Expense Reimbursement Policy, page 2, Trustees traveling distances of more than 3,000 miles will…change the distance to 2,500, made by Joy, seconded by Robert.
Joy H.: This has been a discussion with some Trustees for the last couple of years, traveling, the 3,000 miles is a little high, because some people actually travel 2,998 and by the time they get
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here they‘re completely jet lagged, they literally have to start their travel at 3:00 am to get here by the 5:00 dinner time we have for our Trustee dinner, before beginning at 7:00. I feel we should lower the mileage so they can be here the night before and be fresh and ready to go with us when we do the dinner at 5:00 and start our meeting at 7:00 and they‘re not in their chairs, exhausted. Most of the first nights go until midnight or 1:00 am. They‘ve been awake almost 24 hours. I think it‘s only fair we lower the miles of traveling distance to accommodate that. This is a hardship on the Trustees.
Kim S.: To clarify, the 2,500 miles is one-way, not round-trip.
Joy H.: Correct.
Kim S.: Do we want to modify that?
Joy H.: Yes, I think we should. Please modify the motion to read distance of 2,500 miles one-way.
Richard L.: I think it‘s a great idea, plus the fact that we have a European Trustee that we‘re paying for a room for, because there‘s an extra bed, we won‘t incur an additional cost, except for the per diem. They could share that room, cause it‘s already been paid for. I think it‘s a terrific idea.
Randy G.: The 2,500 miles. The change really affects one Trustee. I don‘t really know where the 2,500 mile circle, would that, this really affects the Atlantic North Trustee.
Robert L.: It potentially could affect the Atlantic South Trustee.
Randy G.: Well, I don‘t know.
Kim S. To clarify, this can potentially affect the Atlantic North and Atlantic South Trustee, depending on what area they live in. Current I believe it would only affect the Atlantic North, and not the Atlantic South, because of where they live.
Russell S.: I speak in favor of this. I know what it‘s like traveling to spend a long time on a plane and getting of an trying to walk straight into a business meeting. I think we have to see to our members, to see that they are healthy when they enter this forum, I think passing this motion would support, not specifically Robert, but future members, and support them in enabling them to be healthy when they sit down for this business meeting.
Randy G.: I guess I‘m not confident that the new number is the right number. If it‘s 2,500 and the next Atlantic South is 2,502…
Unknown: Then we revisit it.
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Randy G.: If we are going to revisit it, why not establish it for the Regional Trustee, and the Atlantic North Regional Trustee, and the Atlantic South Regional Trustee are expensed out differently versus the mileage circle, because we‘re now potentially looking at revisiting this depending if the mileage circle works for our next one or not. So would it be better if we actually look like, identify the Trustees that we allow the extra night stay, and that would potentially additionally include the Atlantic South?
Joy H.: No.
Kim S.: No.
Joy H.: May I respond, why we both said no at the same time? Potentially we could have a Trustee at Large that lives in New York. Or lives in Arkansas or Florida. If we specify certain Trustees, it is limiting. It‘s more than 2,500 miles. So technically if it‘s 2,502 miles, they‘re more than 2,500 miles. That is the wording. What I am changing is it will be 2,500 miles one-way.
Kim S.: For the record, the reimbursement policy reads, at this time: Trustees traveling distances of more than 3,000 miles will be provided a hotel room for one night prior to the even to accommodate jet lag and Trustees traveling distances in excess of 5,000 miles will be provided a hotel room for two nights prior to the event. One for the travel day, and one to adjust to the time differences. As housekeeping, moving forward, we have a friendly amendment, in addition to 2,500 one-way, it should also reflect in excess of 5,000 miles one way, in this paragraph.
Richard L.: I want to throw a monkey in the wrench. Following what Randy was trying to say, maybe you should put a travel time, maybe you have somebody from one of those really small cities, where they got to take two small planes and it might be a ten hour travel time to get here. Some of us can‘t get a direct flight, some of use have to get a two or three hour layover, some of us are in smaller little towns where you got to go two planes over to get to a site, and it might be the travel time that actually the real inconvenience here. Over ten hours of travel time and then you have to be at the airport two hours early.
Kim S.: I would like to address that. There are many logistics here. The ability to have a travel day, period. If we want to talk about specifics here with regard to the current Atlantic North Trustee, the ability to leave out of Providence or out of Boston at 9:00 am does not constitute whether or not it takes ten hours or not. The time is relevant to what time as we, as individuals, can leave. Some of us came in on Thursday this time, some of us come in on Friday morning, some come in several hours before we start. Actually, this came up two years ago, we did discuss it, though we did not take action to change it. It was somewhat of a, well, of course. However, we did not take action. Also, in my recent discussions with Robert, I have checked, based on either convenience or inconvenience to any particular person, it can be done. Robert could get here at noon. That would be an inconvenience, job-wise, time off, flight, whether he flies out of Boston or not, we‘ve discussed all of that, correct Robert?
Robert L.: Yes, we have.
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Kim S.: Now we‘re looking at a combined effort by our policy and someone needing that. We can get into a lot of particulars, we are here until 1:00 and we currently have one Trustee who has left. That‘s another thing we need to address. Depending on what airport one flies out of, this mileage is irrelevant, or not. If you look at his connection time, if you fly out of Providence, your mileage is actually more. Boston, you‘re right in there. You have to do connections, it‘s more mileage, correct?
Robert L.: Yes, correct.
Joy H.: I think when the policy was originally written, it was the distance from their home to, it could be interpreted that way too, as opposed to the distance of the flight. There are many ways to interpret it. It needs to be lowered to accommodate our Trustees, so everyone is fresh when we start, in my opinion, and not sleeping through quarterly meetings, they be permitted to come in one night ahead of time to accommodate the jet lag.
Richard S.: Point of Order. Based on time constraints, let‘s not speak twice to our same motion.
Kim S.: Any other discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes. We will make the changes for that in our policy and upload it to our Yahoo group.
Russell S.: For housekeeping purposes, it mentions the 3,000 miles further on in point 5…
Richard S.: The secretary will handle any housekeeping relating to the motion passed.
Russell S.: Thank you.
Joy H.: I make a motion to increase our per diem per day to $50.
Richard L.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to increase our meal allowance day to $50, made by Joy H., seconded by Richard L.
Joy H.: In 1998, the per diem used to be $35, it was then changed to $40. It has been, for 14 years, and my thinking is that, we‘re here until 2014, breakfast is $16, lunch roughly runs between $10-15, and dinner runs approximately $20-30. Some people think it should go to $60, I‘m more on the conservative side and feel that raising it an additional $10 is conservative and appropriate than raising it any higher to accommodate the rising cost of our meetings.
Kim S.: Please note, we do not receive a per diem, it is a meal allowance…please not that all references to per diem are incorrect, and they should be ―meal allowance.‖
Richard S.: I speak against the motion. To offset our expenses, we are individuals that have to eat anyway, while we are held hostage in this hotel, there is less desirable, less expensive food across the street. I believe the Fellowship is offsetting some of the expenses we incur, but
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shouldn‘t be buying the meals, and most importantly, my personal feeling on this is it‘s like for lack of a better term, I can‘t think of a better example, Congress going into session and giving themselves raises. I believe if we want this, a motion should go onto the floor at Conference. If we believe in it, we take a motion to the Conference floor, not here.
Kim S.: At this point, I‘m sorry, I‘m going to have to call this motion out of order, because it is limited to the annual approved budget, and any changes to the budget will have to go to the Conference floor. Does anyone disagree with this?
Randy G.: So did the last motion.
Kim S.: The provision for travel is set, this would be an increase. That does not have a dollar value, reimbursable expenses do have a set value.
Randy G.: His budget has a value.
Kim S.: The Atlantic North Regional budget does not change. This would change the WSBT budget. It does not say his budget is $300 for travel.
Randy G.: No, but our WSBT budget, because it changes what we just did.
Terry M.: No, it is not going to change the cost of the flight.
Randy G.: As an extra day of per diem.
Terry M.: We did not change the cost of his flight.
Randy G.: We added an extra day of per diem to all three of his LA visits. All three of his visits have an extra day of per diem.
Kim S.: This is part of his budget.
Randy G.: I know it‘s minor, but it does change the budget.
Joy H.: I would like to make a motion that any changes to our expense reimbursement policy do not go into effect until the end of Conference 2011.
Richard L.: For Conference approval, or Finance Committee approval?
Joy H.: Conference does not approve our policy.
Kim S.: It clarifies in point five, this is in regard to expense advances, it says to the limit of the annual approved budget, which is not specified as an advanced expense regarding the mileage.
Peter D.: Second.
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Kim S.: There is a motion that any changes to our expense reimbursement policy do not go into effect until the end of Conference 2011, made by Joy, seconded by Peter.
Joy H.: At the end of Conference, the new budget goes into effect. I am clarifying and speaking to the motion.
Randy G.: Robert won‘t get that extra day of per diem for this Conference.
Kim S.: Actually, the changes you‘re making won‘t go into effect until the next year for the two Trustees.
Joy H.: The worry is, if it is going to affect the budget even though it‘s a minor amount between hotel and per diem, it wouldn‘t change the hotel, technically because Russell comes in two days early, the only thing it would affect is the half day per diem.
Kim S.: Let me clarify this. The motion that all expense reimbursement policy changes that are being made do not go into effect until the close of the Conference, 2011.
Joy H.: Yes.
Richard S.: I speak against the motion. I would like the maker of the motion to reconsider this motion or withdraw. I would stand behind the decision of this Board, absolutely, to discussion that‘s gone on over the past two years to stand at Conference and support the fact that this is necessary to be done, and I have no problem standing behind that at Conference.
Joy H.: Motion withdrawn.
Richard L.: Point of Information. Can someone clarify where we‘re at? I feel like the dog chasing his tail, I‘m lost.
Joy H.: One of my motions was called out of order, the second motion, I withdrew.
Richard L.: Right, so where are we at?
Richard S.: Robert, for the next years quarterlies, will submit expenses for an extra day of travel.
Robert L.: Next year, depending on mileage, not Phoenix, or the Conference this year.
Richard S.: Right, you‘re in the travel area, you‘re good, we know, that‘s why we support you.
Peter D.: Are there any exceptions made for the hotel here for quarterlies? For instance, Thursday night I drove from San Diego to Long Beach for the Office Board meeting, as opposed to driving an hour and a half back and another two hours up on Friday, I drove 15 minutes from the World Service Office to the Hotel and stayed here on Thursday night so I didn‘t have to drive back to San Diego at 12 at night and drive back up here in the morning. Is there any way that
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room could get covered for that Thursday night for me? Or does that have to go through this, or do I just eat that room?
Kim S.: Going forward, you would discuss those issues with the WSBT Chair for any exceptions we might be able to have approved.
Peter D.: Can we do it after the fact, since I didn‘t know what was going on?
Kim S.: No.
Russell S.: Does the WST get a budget? Does he have a travel budget?
Kim S.: Yes.
Peter D.: I‘ve asked for that, nobody has it.
Joy H.: It‘s part of the Office budget.
Richard S.: It is, I will go over it with you, there were expenses as TAL that came out of the WSBT budget.
Peter D.: Can we do that before I leave?
Richard S.: Yes. Joy knows where it is as well.
Joy H.: I did make some corrections to yours because they did charge your whole, and I told them that half was supposed to go under mine from last year not this year. It is miscoded, though that‘s another issue.
Kim S.: On page 2, the first line says: Additional travel can only be reimbursed if it is pre-approved. I‘m open to, as I have done in the past, discussed things with the previous chairs, I went to Denver the night before and the savings on my flight ticket was greater than the one-night stay at the hotel. It was approved that CA would cover that night.
Peter D.: Thank you.
Robert L.: The motion about travel is not about me, it‘s about the Fellowship. It‘s about whatever Trustee is doing their job. We discussed this two years ago, and it‘s been there, I‘ve only been late for one quarterly because of weather. I‘m just saying, it‘s about what‘s best for the WSBT.
Kim S.: My apologies Robert, I didn‘t mean to bypass your comments.
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Randy G.: On page 4 of the Expense Reimbursement Policy, I would like to make a motion on the first paragraph to remove the sentence ―if a Trustee desires his or her own room, it would be the Trustee‘s responsibility to pay for the entire room night.‖
Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to remove, in the Expense Reimbursement Policy, page 4, the first paragraph to remove the sentence ―if a Trustee desires his or her own room, it would be the Trustee‘s responsibility to pay for the entire room night.‖
Randy G.: I keep going back through this paragraph, and to reduce the cost to the Fellowship, Trustees are expected to share rooms. Cool. For quarterly meetings, the WS Trustee will assist in assigning roommates. Cool. However, for the convention and Conference, each Trustee is responsible for ensuring their roommate for the duration of those events. In other words, we‘re asking each other to hook up with each other, or take the greatest opportunity to find a roommate, in essence to ensure their roommate for the duration of those events. It is understood that some situations may arise where this may not be possible and adjustments will be made such as when and odd man out situation and is not created deliberately. Arrangements regarding room sharing must be presented to the WS Trustee and the WSBT Chair in advance of every quarterly meeting, convention and Conference. That‘s a check and a balance that we are attempting to the greatest of our abilities to find a roommate. Now whether that roommate is paid for by an area as a delegate or whether it‘s another Trustee or whether it‘s personally paid for by myself for my significant other, I am essentially responsible for the other half of that room. The best way to do that is to room with each other or room with somebody else. What it does, is we have the check and the balance, it allows for the odd man out situation, as long as it‘s not created deliberately, like I would refuse to do this, or refuse to have a roommate. Well, that‘s when the Chair and World Service Trustee step up and go, dude you‘re taking a position that goes against the essence and intent of this paragraph. In that case we don‘t think we should pay for half your room because you‘d shown us no effort or desire or willingness to ensure your roommate. I think it just cleans it up. Because the idea that a desire to have his or her own room, it would be the Trustee‘s responsibility to pay for the entire room night goes against the responsibility to ensure their roommate. It contradicts each other. Just removing the sentence makes it easy for me.
Richard L.: I speak in favor of the motion. Especially when we get down to convention time. It also helps fill up the rooms. Sometimes at the convention, this way we can end up taking up more rooms if we spread out, and have room commitments, and if we‘re a little bit shy we end up taking up more of the spaces. I know, we get toward the end of the, when we‘re at the conventions and it gets to Friday, Saturdays, the weekends, we have friends or significant others that we like to invite and also stimulate money for the convention, and we want to be able to spend some time with them. It really is a win-win and it‘s a benefit to CA, we are already there to do it. Bringing in additional cash for it. I am in favor of this motion.
Russell S.: I speak against this motion. I hear the validity of some of the points being raised here, I have a concern that we are, excuse my bluntness, making decisions based on self. That‘s how I see it. I am at a convention; I want to be with my family, I don‘t want to be with a roommate. I
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would not want to see the situation arise where this then continues to be actually what we are all getting is half a room rate each, we can come and go as we like. I am not saying anyone would be that harsh with it. However, we are not assigned a half a room ____________. I don‘t believe that‘s the spirit of what has been written here. This is how I see it, it could be worked out with two people without it being in the guidelines, if Richard and I are going somewhere and he chooses to go and share a room, and I go to do the same, but it doesn‘t need to be stated in the guidelines. If it starts to be stated in the guidelines, that is acceptable, I wouldn‘t want to feel somehow pressured if I was sharing with you, and you‘re going to the convention, I don‘t want to feel put upon to have to have a roommate.
Randy G.: That‘s what it already says.
Russell S.: As I understand it, within this circle.
Randy G.: But that‘s not what it says.
Russell S.: Unless I‘m unclear of this motion, I‘m against it. I believe it‘s going to allow us to, I‘ve got half a room to do with what I want with for the duration of the convention and I don‘t want to stay with my assigned roommate as a Trustee.
Joy H.: I am in favor of the motion. Due to the fact that it does say, each trustee is responsible for ensuring their roommate for the duration of those events. Also, for future Trustees, because we do not make it a requirement for those trustees be financially able to be a Trustee, we all know it‘s a lot of time and money to be Trustees. I think if we keep forgetting about future Trustees and restrictions of the financial burden. A lot of us, some of us, a few of us, have no problem financially being Trustees, we are able to take extended time off work, and a lot aren‘t. We need to keep remembering and looking forward to future Trustees who might not financially be able and that we then don‘t bring them forth as Trustees because our expense reimbursements don‘t allow, that they ensure a roommate.
Peter D.: I speak in favor of the motion. If I am going to the convention, which I have to go to, and CA is paying for my half of the room because I‘m rooming with Kenny and they‘re paying for his half of the room and if toward the end of the convention I want to bring out a significant other and he wants to bring out a significant other, and we both get two separate rooms, CA pays for my half and I pay for my significant other‘s half, and same with Kenny. They are going to pay for me and Kenny together, why shouldn‘t they pay for us apart? The other part will be paid by him and me, CA‘s not out any money, if I go out and he‘s all by himself, then they‘re going to pay for his half, they‘re going to pay for that whole room and they‘re going to pay for my half, that can‘t happen. As long as he‘s covered, and I‘m covered, it doesn‘t cost CA any more money, I don‘t see that it‘s a we or a me. I want to have company and he wants to have company. They‘re going to pay for us together or they‘re going to pay for us apart. As long as there‘s another half a day included, I don‘t think there‘s anything wrong with it. I like to bring somebody, if he‘d like to bring somebody, we‘re not incurring any additional charges. If there‘s any additional charges, that would be on me, not on CA, that‘s how I look at it. I speak in favor of the motion. Am I thinking about me, yeah there‘s a little bit of me in there, but it‘s not going
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to cost CA any more money, I put up my time, I know that when I got in here, a little part of going to a convention and having somebody there, get my half paid for one way or another, I don‘t think that is a selfish thing. I‘m here for the benefit of CA.
Kim S.: That situation is unique to the individuals. Let‘s say with Joy and I. We room together, she moves out because her significant other is coming, I have no roommate. The verbiage in the policy needs to be more clear as to what occurs next.
Randy G.: No. It talks about, the situation may arise where this may not be possible, and adjustments be made, such as when an odd man out situation exists and is not created deliberately. That would be a deliberate creation of an odd man out.
Peter D.: Then you pay for that.
Joy H.: But if we ensure a roommate for the duration of the event, then the cost to CA is still the same as if.
Randy G.: The situation of the odd man out being created deliberately covers that issue.
Joy H.: It remains the same as if Kim and I remained as roommates.
Richard S.: I speak against the motion. I find the motion self-serving in its entirety. We are not considering the fact that the Fellowship is paying to get us to the convention. We are still servants of the convention. We are there to serve the entire convention. That‘s part of our duties and responsibilities that we were interviewed and signed up for and the Fellowship is footing the bill. I believe this is nothing but self-serving. I believe if a Trustee chooses to vacate the block that is set aside initially for our stay, they should pay for the room night in its entirety. I am against the motion.
Randy G.: Can I ask how it is self-serving? What do we get?
Richard S.: We are taking a room night out of the room block. What if it‘s a full convention? A member does not have a room if we‘re splitting up rooms because we only have…
Randy G.: Is that a problem, has that been a problem in any of our hotels outside of maybe two?
Richard S.: It‘s minimal, absolutely. It is a consideration.
Randy G.: We have more desire to fill rooms.
Richard S.: Absolutely we do. I feel this is 100% self-serving to, I would personally like to have my own room, my own space. I like rooming with Russell; I think it‘s healthy.
Randy G.: But if you chose to do that deliberately, that created an odd man out…
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Richard S.: I would have to pay for the whole room.
Randy G.: And that‘s what it says now.
Richard S.: Correct.
Randy G.: With the removal of the sentence, it does not take that away.
Richard S.: What the motion caring to do is saying someone wants to do it, have at it, split it up and have CA pay for half the room, encouraging people to get their own rooms and expect CA to pay for half the room. Stating they can occupy the room, CA is going to pay for half of it, but I‘m paying for the other half so it‘s okay. Not considering that CA has paid for us to get there. CA is paying for us to eat there. All that into consideration, I believe we have an obligation to consolidate and save money.
Randy G.: It doesn‘t cost the Fellowship a single dollar more.
Richard S.: It can, splitting the two rooms apart. Taking a room night and potential income away from the convention, where we get that.
Randy G.: It can add extra revenue from the extra room.
Richard S.: Not if the hotel is full.
Randy G.: $10 a night it does.
Richard S.: We do not get that rebate if we are occupying those rooms any paying for half.
Kim S.: I would like to interject that I contact one of the original Trustees that formatted this and ask for clarification. For me, it reads for the convention and Conference, each Trustee is responsible for ensuring their roommate for the duration of those events. There needs to be more clarification as to why this was written the way it was, I would take it upon myself to contact one of the original Trustees that wrote this. Please consider tabling this until we have further explanation as to why it was written as it was.
Richard S.: Can we a motion table this with a time frame so it can be, depending how a vote goes it can be applied to the upcoming convention.
Kim S.: Of course, I will be more than happy to contact someone.
Randy G.: Unless it happens quickly…
Richard S.: That‘s why I offered a time frame.
Randy G.: Motion to table.
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Joy H.: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to table the previously stated motion. All those in favor? Anyone opposed? Motion passes. Next Item #2011.03.03 Regional Issues in the World Service Manual. This was addressed in the Board-to-Board, please remove it from the agenda. Item #2011.03.04, WSBT Ratification, that was an item heard out of order and is done. Item #2011.03.5, Hiring and Ratification of the DOO was an item heard out of order and completed, please remove this from the agenda. Is there any other new business we need to address at this time?
Terry M.: I was really offended by the statement yesterday offline that implicated secretive and it was actually kind of hurtful to hear that word coming from the WSOB. We‘re entrusted to do a job whether I have full information or not. When I look at a matter and I figure and it definitely affects CA as a whole, part of my duty is to know this kind of stuff, whether it was legal or not, to be told it was secret and not for eyes. I think that we‘re elected into a position, although I don‘t need to know all the details, we know how stuff travels around this Fellowship no matter what. Whether it‘s supposed to be secretive or not, I have to put myself in the position of if I was sitting in the Meet the Trustee or my regional caucus and somebody else came up to me and asked me asked a question about something that was removed at one time, and my answer to them is as far as I know it was removed, and then they hear a remark back and hear, well I hear there‘s another one. I‘m not trying to point out a specific thing. I think I would have got more angry at that point than yesterday. I really believe that maybe wrong words were used, I know I‘m not the only person in the room that felt that way. Like I said, it‘s not about knowing all the details. I just need to be aware of what‘s going on in the Fellowship. I just need to state for the record, I was offended by that statement. I have to have a certain amount of trust inside this room, to be elected to a position that my region trusts me and respected me enough to put me in this seat, and the TEC trusted me enough to put me in this seat, that my integrity shouldn‘t be questioned, we shouldn‘t have to say what‘s said in here stays in here. That was one of the very first principles I heard when I walked into my first meeting. I just needed to put that on the record.
Peter D.: If something happened at the WSOB and there is an attorney involved, and the attorney asks me as the Trustee not to tell anybody, what do I do, listen to the attorney or come back and tell you what the attorney says?
Randy G.: My suggestion would be to look the attorney straight in the face and tell him that the service structure of this entity is not an individual, but it is a body and a board, I cannot represent myself as a Trustee here if I‘m not willing to pass along the information that I receive here to the Trustees that I stand side by side with as a group.
Peter D.: When that conversation came up and I said well, I don‘t answer to me, I answer to a Board. He said if this gets out, it could be really bad for your organization.
Randy G.: I understand that, and I absolutely trust the people on my Board.
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Peter D.: Thank you, I will do that.
Kim S.: Moving forward, I will fully confide in this Board, everything and all that is discussed with me by the WSOB Chair and Consulting Manager in clarification of what was passed on to me, I was asked not to discuss it until all of the information was compiled and put forward. On the record, I apologize to you all. My intention was never to suggest that anyone was less than trustworthy or to question your integrity whatsoever. That is the truth, if you do not believe that, then you do not know me. With that being said, is there anything else anybody else would like to say? With words, not body language or eyes.
Richard L.: Madame Chair, I want to thank you for doing a wonderful job.
Peter D.: I would like to say what Kim said. Being new, I just did what an attorney told me to do, it had nothing to do with you people, as far as not trusting, nothing like that. This is new to me. He said, until we find out, just keep it to yourself. That won‘t happen again. If that requires an apology, I apologize. It was not done maliciously or non-trusting. I took advice from somebody we pay for, for advice.
Russell S.: I have a question. While I respect it was a necessity to put something on the record, we have begun speaking of something specific which we had hoped to keep within this room. Will Peter‘s comments regarding the attorney be struck?
Kim S.: We will have an opportunity to edit the minutes when they are transcribed, please edit your own comments as you see fit. If you‘re not sure how they should be edited, please refer to your buddy, your vice-chair, and your secretary. Is there any other new business? The last item is a group inventory, which we go off-line for. It is currently 1:20 pm. If we can move through this last portion.
It is 2:02 pm pacific standard time. We have completed our last item of business, our group inventory. We are a little bit over our extended time, however, it was necessary to complete the business of Cocaine Anonymous. Thank you all for being here. I would entertain a motion to close.
Peter D.: I make a motion to close.
Group: Second.
Kim S.: There is a motion to close by Peter, seconded by the whole bunch of them. Any discussion? All those in favor? Anyone opposed? We will close with the Serenity Prayer, if anyone can help Richard Leve pack up his stuff that would be great.
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For all attached documents and reports see pdf: 2011-03-11-13-WSBT-Quarterly-Meeting-Minutes.pdf